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Akril15 β Mind the (Age) Gap...
Published: 2014-06-17 09:47:51 +0000 UTC; Views: 17393; Favourites: 297; Downloads: 0
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While I was writing up a lengthy discussion on The Lion Guard, I realized something somewhat amusing: A number of fans believe that Kion is Kopa, or at the very least based on Kopa.However, if "Kion=Kopa" and Kion really is going to be born after the end of SP, there might be a slight problem for some Kopa fans -- a problem which centers around a certain blue-eyed lioness...
Why didn't I give Kion pads on his back toes? Because 1) We haven't seen his back paws in any official art (yet); 2) I was seeing how I could tweak his design without completely changing it; and 3) Nala's back paws are like that when she's a cub.
(I was thinking of leaving his back toes uncolored as well, but that seemed like a bit of a stretch...even though that trait, combined with Kion's pale eyes and brown nose, would have borne an uncanny similarity to the newborn cub that made a cameo in one episode of The Lion King's Timon and Pumbaa. )
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Comments: 60
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I got an idea, you should do adult Vitani teasing Kion and he is looking quite irritated by how she is teasing him.
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I don't take requests anymore, but that does seem like an interesting idea.
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To be honest I never knew about Kopa until I joined DA I don't have a problem with it thoe.
I just think it's silly on how people make such a big deal out of it he's not even cannon he's semi cannon.
In my headcannon nala gave birth (in one litter in no specific order) kiara the future queen, kopa advisor/queens right hand and kion the gard leader and vitani lead huntress (after she rejoined the pride) mate's for kion and kopa is tiffu and zuri
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I've actually been in the TLK fandom so long that I can remember a time before Kopa became as well-known as he is now. Most of the fan fiction that preceded SP featured a fanon character named Tanabi as Simba's son, who had no established personality or appearance, so there was a lot more creative freedom with him, and SP sort of "overwrote" him, although there was still some fan material featuring a male cub as Kiara's brother.
It wasn't until scans of TLK6NA became widely available that the Kopa craze started to take off, and though I've played with the concept a bit, I've never taken it very seriously (most of my art and writing featuring him takes place in alternate continuities). I just don't know what's come over some of the fandom these days.
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That Look is Priseless*Nina Willams Impression*
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I ship them but not because I think Kopa has something to do with that xD
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I am not a kopa fan boy or anything BUT he does have a personality I have the books 
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Don't pay any attention to them, that's just Kopa fantards whining because they can't accept that Disney want nothing to do with that cub Simba clone. I can almost guarantee that nobody in the entire production team of The Lion Guard knows who Kopa is, and if they do; they don't care.Β
Great drawing by the way
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This has nothing to do with Kopa, but I just don't really like Kion. I don't hate him, by any means, but he's not the greatest character ever. Just because I like the idea of Simba having Kopa does not mean I'm a fantard, right? This idea kind of gives me an explanation to the cub at the end of TLK, because no matter what people say, the cub at the end is NOT Kiara in MY opinion. And no, I don't worship Kopa, he's just food for thought, fanfiction, and creativity. Nothing more. Please don't hate me.
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Yeah, I have a sort of morbid fascination with the way some fans are reacting. I don't search for Kion art on here as much as I used to (mostly because so much of it is recolored and/or traced screenshots), but I remember seeing some fans reacting so negatively that they were coming up with ideas on how Kion could be killed.
This sparked an idea for a comic (that I may never finish) where Kion apprehensively approaches Kopa, who is sitting alone in a spotlight that's filled with fan art of him, though in his shadow, there are pictures that show him being brutally killed. As Kion steps into the spotlight (thinking he doesn't belong there), fan art of him starts appearing, and several pictures that show him getting killed start appearing in his shadow. Kopa then remarks, "Don't worry. See? They're already welcoming you."
I've got a pet theory that a lot of Kopa fans are more in love with their interpretation of Kopa than the character himself. Even if, by some miracle, Kopa was included in this series, there would be thousands of fans complaining that the way he's depicted doesn't jive with their interpretation of him.
I'm also astounded at the number of people complaining that Kion is a Kopa clone. The mindset of some of these people...
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That's exactly right, Kopa is a blank slate. Disney didn't create a story (or a personality) for him, so that leaves fans in complete control of his fictional, non existent life. Which is why fans go so crazy over it, they can do whatever they want with him, and do! So yes, they love Kopa for who he COULD have been, rather than for he is! Which makes little sense really, that's like somebody loving you for who they can turn you into, rather than for being yourself. It's a selfish kind of love. Kopa didn't do or achieve anything to get his popularity, somehow he didn't have to!
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As a Kopa fan myself, I can admit that his personality in the books (Or what I've seen from them) is actually pretty dry, yes. People may complain about Kiara being the "whiny" one, but I say Kopa was far, far worse at that than she could ever hope to be. The fan rage over him is part of the reason I don't even draw him as much as I'd like to. With that said, I still do think his story can be very interesting, and shed a lot of light on the backstory to SP. I don't totally gush over him like other Kopa fans do, though. I don't act like the 6NA books are like the Bible of TLK, nor do I act like he's a messiah. I believe he was just one part of a larger story, which is why he's not a complete be-all, end-all factor to the franchise. I think it's all about moderation; Something many seem to lack in regards to him.
As for Kion: Despite my interest in Kopa, I'm still very excited to see what he can do and what his character will be like. Will I be a bit disappointed that Kopa likely won't be acknowledged? Sure. But I'd never wish death on the poor guy just because of that. I'm surprised there's people out there actually wanting him dead already. Like, what? Literally all we have to go by for him is 2 pictures and a 2 second GIF. Is that really enough to warrant death threats already? At least with the Kiara hate, we've had 17+ years to get to know her character and form an opinion on her. With Kion? We have nothing. I can agree, the whole ordeal annoys me just as much as it annoys you.
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whaddya know, Kion is a male version of a cougar 
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A "cougar" is an older woman that goes after younger men. Kion would have to be much older than Vitani for him to be the male version of that.
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This is the funniest thing I have ever seenΒ Β Β
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Tani, Kiara, and Kovu are like about 16-19 years old in humans years, but it makes sense.
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probably even older lol
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By the time Kion is born, maybe! XD
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awkward... but give kion a couple years and it could work 
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loool poor Vitani , he is so young , he is just a cub and she is a grow up lioness , this is going to be funny !
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This is so funny and cute.
Kopa fans just need to accept that Kopa isnβt canon (even the people who worked on TLK said he wasnβt part of the real TLK movie universe and that the cub at the end of the film was genderless) and never had a chance to be in the films or seriesto begon with. Getting rid of Kiara or Kion wasnβt going to change that; Kopa still wouldnβt have become part of the movie universe even if Kiara and Kion didnβt exist.
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I'm a Kopa fan, and my opinion WILL stay the same. Do not reply to meΒ with something like "but it's true he's not canon blah blah blah", I have my own thoughts.
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You can believe whatever you want. My opinion won't change either.
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That's fine with me. We can just agree to disagree.Β Β Β
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bwahahahahahah lmao! omg vitani's face is priceless lol poor kion
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Some tells me Vitani is going to be forgoten in this new series.....
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I'm inclined to agree. Though I'm suspect that Kovu may make a couple of cameos, I highly doubt that the writers would be able to cram Vitani in.
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Or worse, they could put in a random lioness and claim it to be Vitani!
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I suspect that we might have a repeat of what happened with Sarafina and Sarabi, where there will be a Outlander(ish) lioness that briefly appears in the TLG movie/show that a bunch of fans will point at, saying, "Look! It's Vitani!" even though her eyes are red, she's missing her freckles and/or ear rims, etc.
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Well, it is a cliche to be sure that I have seen in kid's shows, but I think it'd be more 'puppy love' than anything else.
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The "puppy love" thing I could imagine, though I can't help but picture Vitani getting just a tad irritated by Kion's affections (especially if she still has a little bit of animosity for Pridelanders).
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Even though i ship kopa and vitani, I would like to see this in the new series. alike ravens post, a little kid crushing on vitamin throughout the show would be funny to see :3
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Though I could see Kion looking up to an older character as if they were an older sibling, I can't really picture a cub his age having actual romantic feelings toward that character, especially when she's old enough to be his mother.
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Wait vitamin is supposed to be vitani *falls to knees* DARN U AUTO-CORRECT!!!
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i'm gonna hate this new series.
First of all, it doesn't tie the first two movies together or answer some questions that I had burning in my head for a long time.
*At the end of the first movie, the cub born to simba and nala at the end of the first film was clearly a male. The staff named him fuzzy but in the books, he was called Kopa. He was born some time BEFORE kiara was born so he would have been her older brother. Why did they change it to a female cub at the 2nd film?
*How did zira get into the picture? She wasn't mentioned anywhere in the first film and she just appeared out of nowhere wanting revenge on Simba, which made no sense to me. If Zira existed in the first film and had been Scar's queen then watched him die after the fight with Simba, then it would give her more reason to be obsessed with killing Simba.
*If Scar wasn't the father of Kovu, who was his real father and how did he get adopted into the family as Scar's heir? Wouldn't Nuka be first choice simply because of his age?
*This cub came out of nowhere. how is that going to flow with the other two storylines and how would that affect Kiara? Wouldn't that put her and Kovu 2nd in line?
The only way this cub would work well is if that cub is kopa, disappeared at the beginning of the 2nd film and came back as an adult. Or if this cub had been a son of Kovu and Kiara... Well played disney well played. you just screwed up one of the best disney films of all time with inconsistent storylines and sequels...
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Kion will be a lion guard and since Kiara is the eldest, she would still be next for the crown.
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"*At the end of the first movie, the cub born to simba and nala at the end of the first film was clearly a male. The staff named him fuzzy but in the books, he was called Kopa. He was born some time BEFORE kiara was born so he would have been her older brother. Why did they change it to a female cub at the 2nd film?Β "
The cub at the end of the first film is a genderless, nameless character nick-named "Fluffy" and was there for the only purpose of completing the "circle of life" concept played out through out the entire movie. At this point they had no idea TLK was going to be a huge hit, so they didn't predict a sequel. Kopa is a semi canon character that was published in a few books from a independent author that was published by Disney. This does not make him official, especially considering there were plenty of other comics and characters that don't take in regard the First movie. I distinctly remember a comic where Nala and Simba go visit Timon and Pumbaa during the time of Mufasa; which definitely didn't happen. And there were lots of other semi canon cubs in books and comics that never appeared in the first movie such at Tojo, Tama, Chumvi, Malka and so on. So Kopa basically lives in a independent universe to the films. Kiara, if you consider movies canon and everything else semi canon, is the only real child of Simba to reach canon status. Kion will also be considered semi canon due to the fact that it's a spin off series, similar to TLK1.5 and the tv show Timon and Pumbaa.Β
*How did zira get into the picture? She wasn't mentioned anywhere in the first film and she just appeared out of nowhere wanting revenge on Simba, which made no sense to me. If Zira existed in the first film and had been Scar's queen then watched him die after the fight with Simba, then it would give her more reason to be obsessed with killing Simba.Β
The second movie needed a villain and there is a huge chunk of TLK that we don't see. Basically the period where Simba is in the jungle and grows up. What happens in the Pride Lands at that time? All we see of Scar's Reign is him taunting Zazu, and then Simba over throwing him. It would be possible that he took in a pride of outlanders, and they weren't present during the over-throwing of Scar. Then you don't see much more after that point, just Simba suddenly as king. Plenty of time for the outlanders to be exiled. Of course, they weren't actually in the first film because they weren't predicting a sequel. But TLK2 needed a bad guy and they made Zira. And Zira, in the final cut, was a devoted follower not Scar's queen. And devotion can do crazy things.
"*If Scar wasn't the father of Kovu, who was his real father and how did he get adopted into the family as Scar's heir? Wouldn't Nuka be first choice simply because of his age?"
None of Zira's kids were Scar's kids. Because in the final film cut Zira wasn't Scar's mate. And that is also stated by directors and producers. So Scar, since they weren't his kids, could pick which ever one he wanted. And he went with the stronger cub, and not the gangly, weak looking Nuka.
"*This cub came out of nowhere. how is that going to flow with the other two storylines and how would that affect Kiara? Wouldn't that put her and Kovu 2nd in line?Β "
It is assumed it's taking place after TLK2 as Kiara's younger brother. Though it is possible he exists in the in-between period of Kiara's cub hood and adult hood; that part of the movie we don't see. And it would be easy to explain his absence as Kiara reaches adult-hood and meets Kovu due to death or something. Similar with what people do in regards to semi-canon Kopa.
So I really don't see how Kopa has anything to do with this time line, to be honest. He's semi canon. The story doesn't NEED him because he's not official. Same with all the other semi canon cubs. Kion doesn't effect Kopa at all, and he definitely isn't Kopa. And basing your opinion about a semi-canon cub and deciding off the bat you're going to hate the story without watching it is kind of narrow minded.Β
The fandom is a creative thing. We are free to make our own fake theories and stories to fit our own means. But when it comes down to the "official" time line you can't say things are wrong just because it doesn't fit your personal fandom. Movies and what the directors say are fact are canon. Kopa, and any other character that comes from spin off series, concept art and scripts, comics, books etc are semi canon and the universe doesn't rely on them to make sense.Β
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(Heads up -- looong reply...)
*At the end of the first movie, the cub born to simba and nala at the end of the first film was clearly a male. The staff named him fuzzy but in the books, he was called Kopa. He was born some time BEFORE kiara was born so he would have been her older brother. Why did they change it to a female cub at the 2nd film?
The cub was called "Fluffy", actually, but Kopa is only featured in one series of books (The Lion King: Six New Adventures) plus two audio plays ("Friends for Life", "Fight for the Throne"). A lot of fans blend the continuities of the movies and these tie-ins, but there are a few ways in which the two universes could easily contradict each other. For one, in the audio plays, Timon and Pumbaa have returned to their jungle, and the hyenas are still living in the Elephant Graveyard (also, Ed talks), and obviously, there's no mention of Zira or any other characters that can be interpreted to be Outsiders in any of these books. Also, the sotry of how Zazu became Mufasa's majordomo and the time when Rafiki came to the Pride Lands are contradicted by stories in other TLK storybooks. There are so many subtle contradictions that merging the books and the movies is probably something best left undone.
Yes, the cub at the end of TLK did have colors like a male, but it was different than baby Simba in several ways. Unlike baby Simba, it had ear rims and coloring inside the ear as well. It also has no spots, and interestingly, baby Nala has always been spotless in various pieces of TLK merchandise. Making the cub a girl was probably the writers' way of bringing a new "twist" to the story, which wasn't too unusual, though they could have at least tried to make her design a little more consistant with the TLK cub's look. From what I've read, SP was originally going to feature two cubs (a boy and a girl), but the focus gradually shifted to Simba's daughter and her brother ended up getting scrapped.
*How did zira get into the picture? She wasn't mentioned anywhere in the first film and she just appeared out of nowhere wanting revenge on Simba, which made no sense to me. If Zira existed in the first film and had been Scar's queen then watched him die after the fight with Simba, then it would give her more reason to be obsessed with killing Simba.
Zira, the Outsiders' origins, Kovu, Nuka and Vitani's father are still mysteries, and probably not ones that are going to be answered in TLG. Though I'm not annoyed that these questions remained unanswered, it would be difficult to integrate answers to all the TLK mysteries in a single movie/series unless they play some role in the story -- otherwise it's going to seem more like an animated TLK infodump than an exciting new story set in the Pride Lands.
SP was sadly somewhat rushed, and there were a lot of parts that could have been explained a bit more, but it seems like a lot of the questions are left up to the fans to answer. A couple of the film's writers have been asked about some of these unsolved mysteries, but their answers tend to be snubbed by fans who refuse to accept them, (like the revelation that Zira wasn't Scar's mate - img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20β¦ ), so that sort of thing kind of seems like a fool's errand.
*If Scar wasn't the father of Kovu, who was his real father and how did he get adopted into the family as Scar's heir? Wouldn't Nuka be first choice simply because of his age?
A lot of fans have theorized that Nuka wasn't chosen because he was a little..."special", so to speak. Another theory has to do with Scar deliberately choosing his younger (adopted) son to be his heir to deliberately go against the tradition which states that firstborn sons will always be first in line for the throne.
*This cub came out of nowhere. how is that going to flow with the other two storylines and how would that affect Kiara? Wouldn't that put her and Kovu 2nd in line?
Kiara is mentioned as being "future Queen" in this article. As for the previous question, hopefully it will be answered in TLG. We just have to wait and see. I'm honestly surprised they are trying to tie SP in with this series, considering all the plotholes it spawned and the way that Disney developed a habit of "backtracking" towards the end of the Disney sequel phenomenon, making spinoffs, interquels and prequels instead of building on the foundations laid by movies like The Little Mermaid II, Tarzan II, etc.
The only way this cub would work well is if that cub is kopa, disappeared at the beginning of the 2nd film and came back as an adult. Or if this cub had been a son of Kovu and Kiara... Well played disney well played. you just screwed up one of the best disney films of all time with inconsistent storylines and sequels...
Though giving Kovu and Kiara a cub is an appealing idea, I don't know if making Simba and Nala into grandparents would really work. Even with Kion's appearance, Simba definitely is the star of the TLK franchise, and having him become a grandfather -- a figure associated with wisdom and love, but also with frailty and old age -- might clash a bit with the bright-eyed, playful cub that we've come to know and love. Many of Disney's characters are virtually ageless, and very few (if any) of them that we get to see growing from babies to adults start to grow old and gray. Of course, Simba could be just as active as he was in SP with no changes to his physical appearance (aside from some improved colors and character design, please), but that might leave a few older viewers scratching their heads and wondering just what kind of lifespan the animals in the TLK universe have.
And I honestly wouldn't gear myself up to hate TLG just yet, especially when we still know so little about it and it will be more than a year before the movie comes out. There were many TLK fans who got pretty annoyed when the news about Pumbaa causing the animals to bow in the Circle of Life sequence in TLK1.5 was announced prior to that film's release, and were more than ready to boycott it for being a cheap cash-in full of juvenile humor and unfunny parodies of the majesty of the original film. However, TLK1.5 turned out to be surprisingly less bad than many of these fans feared, and even the fans that didn't like it didn't feel that the movie had ruined the original movie (which has already been mocked and lampooned numerous times on the Timon and Pumbaa TV series). We still have the original movie, and though SP and TLK1.5 do exist and they may have changed some people's views of the original, TLK is still the same movie it always was. The sequels and spin-offs can easily be disregarded as non-canon, which is a view many fans have taken, and I think it's safe to say they'll disregard TLG as well.
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