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RexBlazer1 — The Guiding Hand
#primus #transformersanimated #adaptus #mortilus #solomus #gudinghand #epistemus
Published: 2018-01-02 06:57:30 +0000 UTC; Views: 4106; Favourites: 60; Downloads: 0
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Description
According to a religious story, the Guiding Hand were formed after the creation of the planet Cybertron when Primus the First Light stood forth on the miracle planet, created in reaction to an unknown opposite (free guesses who). At the time, he felt a nest of sparks within him and he split his essence into five other vessels. They became a remote but nurturing presence on early Cybertron and populated it with a gesture, thus creating the Transformer race. Under their reign came the First Golden Age of Cybertron, which was shattered when Mortilus believed that the Guiding Hand should become a fist against the rest of the universe. As Mortilus stood against Primus, all of Cybertron became divided in a conflict that saw the planet shudder and its first moon being ripped asunder. The Death-bringer was ultimately destroyed in the struggle but the conflict left the remaining members of the Guiding Hand mortally wounded.Primus who was near death went into the heart of Cybertron where he re-integrated himself to the planet and became Vector Sigma that was the source of all sentience. Solomus was trapped by Mortilus into a crystal prison but the wise god managed to re-arrange it into the Creation Matrix that not only served as a connection to Vector Sigma but provided wisdom to future generations of Transformers. Both Epistemus and Adaptus were not as lucky as Mortilus had stripped both bare. Epistemus was transformed into a brain module whilst Adaptus became a transformation cog. Prior to their death, they offered their designs to future generations to utilize both their intellect and functionality to face the rigors of their environment. With Mortilus's destruction, death itself was gone and this allowed the sparks of Cybertronians to burn perpetually, rendering them functionally ageless. After this period, the first inheritors of the Guiding Hand became the Knights of Cybertron who were given the gifts of sentience, wisdom, intellect, change and immortality whereupon they went to spread peace across the universe.
All five members of the Guiding Hand brought together in Animated-style and in a group shot. These aren't the only notable gods in TF lore, but their story is an interesting one to say the least.
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Comments: 22
Hey Rex I gotta question what are the two balls around primus meant to be?
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All things must have balance, Life and Light have Shadow and Death, Wisdom and Adaptation have Ignorance and Stagnation. The way I see it Primus is more the embodiment of balance and that is why there are often negitives in his sons and daughters.
As Prima is also thought to be part of these in some writings he is the true foil to Mortilus as a light giver and Lifer giver too. Though Primus is the same embodiment that may not be the case but here there are fewer balances since Wisdom and knowledge are not mutually exclusive to each other after all they often go hand in hand. The Guiding Hand was greatly unbalanced since not one of them countered the other save Primus and Mortilus who are Life and Death counters to each other.
Seeing how we already know that Mortilus' existance wasn't fully tethered to Death with Cybertronians dying all the time and new life being very precious to moder Cybertron Mortilus lives on as do his brothers in some manner with his gift of Mortality being part of Cybertronians like the Tcog, Brain Module, The Matrix and Vector Sigma.
Like I said balance is key with cosmic level beings like the Thirteen, Covenant, and Guiding Hand. The Thirteen have Prima and Megatronus as the biggest example I.E. Light and Shadow, Growth and decay but it's not limited to just those two Alpha Trion or Solomus are intellectual incarnations of the type that recored and observe Maximo is intellectual incarnate on the opposite side being one to make his own history and deceit. Onyx is often seen as the largest with Micronus being the smallest, Solus creates machines to better help her fellow primes that are material in nature Quintus he creates the seeds for a world to begin life and by extension the core essence of a living creature a Soul or Spark.
This is something I want to keep the trend of with my thirteen. Each one has a counter embodiment of the same nature to keep everything from going out of control with the thirteenth literally being Primus' chosen keeper of Balance much like in the Aligned universe with Optimus's old life where he was the only one that was able to keep the others together even after Megatronus' fall he did not give up on him till Maximo forced his hand.
Hmm I just noticed all of your Cybertronian Deity designs that have wings have eight wings that would mean they are also Seraphim deitys which keeps in line with their natures and creation. I don't know if it was intentional on your part my friend but it is a fitting indeed.
I'll reply to the notes tomorrow my friend my schedule was thrown for a loop today hence why it took so long for me to reply.)
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I agree on the themes of balance, but there's a bit of a concern I have with it, which is part of my jaded feelings toward IDW Publishing's comics, where this version of the Primus story originated. It's told in a manner that can be interpreted a number of ways. A couple parts that don't hold up from the story are the gift of immortality and the destruction of one of Cybertron's moons since it's shown that Cybertronians can die of old age and age-related illnesses and the moon wasn't destroyed but rather moved for some unknown reason. Aside from that, the story held up since, for a while anyway, other writers had taken it at face value and ran with it, bringing up various parts of it into the modern day and making additions.
But as I've said, there's a problem. The writer who came up with this version of the Primus story, James Roberts, has a bit of a history to him. You see, before he wrote for official Transformers canon, he was known for his fanfiction, "Transformers: Eugenesis," a continuation of the Marvel UK Transformers stories. A major plot point in that fic was the revelation that Primus and Unicron were actually a couple of A.I.s created by the Quintessons to keep the Transformers in check, and in general, the story shows a lot of disdain for characters like Primus.
In Roberts' canon writing at IDW, he doesn't shy away from the setup of presenting evidence in history as supposed fact only to pull the "unreliable narrator" trope and reveal that the events in question went in a different direction. He does this quite a bit, to the point of predictability, and one common method he employs is having the heroes about to meet someone or something that is supposedly divine or supernatural only for that person or thing be revealed as a huge letdown either by being revealed as fake or not what they/it seems.
Based on how the comics have been going, Roberts appears to be heading in the same direction with Primus and the Guiding Hand, and other IDW Transformers writers like John Barber appear to be following suit. The problem with that is that it messes with continuity, as supernatural elements are confirmed to be real in that world, but last time I checked, IDW was more concerned anymore with political agendas rather than adhering to continuity and telling good stories, which is part of why I'm jaded towards them.
As for the wings, well, it wasn't really my intention for them to be like Seraphim deities, but you're free to interpret them that way if you wish. In actuality, the whole wing thing came from the fact that most depictions of Primus and Unicron have the latter with wings while the former doesn't. I sought to correct that here.
I look forward to your replies, but take your time, no rush.
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It came off as very "IN YOUR FACE!!" towards religion, introduced gender politics, and the writer of the GI Joe comics at the time didn't seem to have a high opinion of the military or show much respect towards people who mourn for the 9/11 victims.
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Ok I can understand the religion and military one but what gender politics?
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Well, James Roberts introduced a couple of transgender TFs who made the transition from male to female. The reason those two made the change was that they'd interacted with other species that had gender and thus got a better understanding of it. From what I've heard, this actually offended some real-life transgender people since, according to them, "That's not how it works!"
Also, I'm not saying that them having romance or even gay romance was a problem, just the fact that the same-sex couples took up about 80% of the romantic relationships that got any kind of focus. Any hetero relationships were few and far between. It was kind of obnoxious in the way they were presented like, at times, it seemed as if that the only kind of romance they wanted to show. Not to mention some of them felt a bit forced and out of nowhere, a big example of that being Arcee and Aileron as, according to some of the people on this very website, even those who did want the two of them to get together admitted that it felt out of left field.
Again, I'm not saying that they shouldn't have same-sex couples, just that they should've handled it better.
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Really, I usually heard praise for the gay couples. But should it really matter if there happens to be more gay couples than hetro ones.
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So you agree that they should've handled that a little better?
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I mean I guess Arcee and Aileron could've gotten more screen time time but everything else besides giving Ironhide and Chromia more screen time would probably stay the same. And hey at least they actually didn't kill they're gays so thats good *cough*Voltron&shit*cough*
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Maybe, though I think that they were putting a bit more emphasis on Chromia's relationship with Windblade than with Ironhide.
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Indeed balance is a key to things working well. A off shaped wheel will eventually shake itself apart and the same goes for story and Mythos too. Yeah the fact that barring the few Immortal sparks like that of Starscream and Rampage the whole thing falls on it's head and last I checked even in IDW there are two moons so the whole thing should be taken with a grain of salt, Primus is the source and transformation is part of a Cybertronian's nature I honestly detest the T-Cog biomech thing since it renders a thing as simple as having a heart (Which can be repaired or replaced with a synthetic one or a trasplant.) that beats in a human be rendered moot with no repair of any kind short of magic Voice boxes I can see since my father had cancer of the throught and hasn't a voice technically of course it only means he has a softer deeper voice than he should comparable to Bee's beeping in Prime he still talks but only the members of his race and Raf for some reason understand him but T-Cogs not being replaceable is stupid if you ask me. (Of course I mean replaceable as in one can be built with the right components as a Transplant has always been possible.)
Oh joy a guy who tried to retcon a being of devine power out as a trick to keep them balenced as slaves. Yeah I can see exactly where this will lead to and I'll explain in a moment but in most G1 Universes Unicron is a creation of Primacon not the Quintisons and a race whose trials with a guilty verdict means you win and innocent means death shouldn't be trusted ever. The whole fact is even in my storylines I'm making Primus and Unicron creations of something greater than simple five faced schizos or a monkey looking Fruit Loop with a Lord Zedd complex.
As I mentioned above I can just see where this will lead this guy sounds like a real Ken Penders. A man who is far too attached to his own interpretations that even if he's got a established continuity he will try his pit cursed most to put it into a story and get angry when someone else makes his ideal design and tells it properly wil the right elements in place. As a example it would be like me trying to have the Dinobots be Dinozords in a continuity where it makes no sense (In my comic I fully intend to Make Grimlock, Slag and a Oc of mine who is a enhanced clone ala Mewtwo of Grimlock named Graveheart be the red tyrannosaurs, blue triceratops and Dragonzord in altmode the othe Dinobots are to be similar style robots of their Dino counterparts since we know only three Dinozords not including Titanus were actual Dinosaurs the other two were prehistoric mammals.) as they would of been either built on earth or rebuilt on earth into Dinobots based off the skeletal fossils of the real things. Seriously it would be bad in so many ways in a true G1 universe least of all with copyright.
I am planning to do my best to keep from creating plotholes through unreliable narrator in any of my works both original and Fan based. I won't say one thing then allow another writer to mix it up or for me to change my mind otherwise I will do like a friend of mine is doing and go back to the comic I want replaced and change that directly to show I'm creating the alteration from the proper place essentially preforming a ripple effect on my comic with nothing set in stone as I like it. But I would not write one thing in a plot line then a chapter or two down the line be like "What oh no I didn't say that I meant this." it's an excuse for laziness if you ask me someone who can't be bothered to even remember their work.
Yeah I have noticed a lot of political concepts used in the IDW comics. The inuniverse kind like the Functionist and the DJD group Nickel was part of all reek of trying to push a stupid political view on things. I mean the Prowl I know wasn't a prick with his worst flaws being overconfidence and short sight but all around he was not a jerk. As to the Supernatural aspects since day one there has been some kind of Magic and or devine things in the Primax cluster. We even had real wizard magic in one episode of the cartoon and Starscream's Ghost is real too thanks to his Immortal spark. So why try to shunt that away heck the existence of Sparks as being lifeforce given form means divinity created life since sparks don't just form in a Protoform without help like human souls being part of them since birth which also shows a higher power.
He just makes himself look like a fool doing this. Established elements should never be retconed unless this is another universal stream like Animated's Malgus and even then supernatural things happen all the time. Processor Overmatter and the Allspark Shards give life to certain machines and powers to others like the remote and stopwatch. Even in cases where Primus has no influence proper there are still things that cannot be explained by science.
Ah the wings I understand came from your want to have all of them with wings to be more connected as Brothers of sorts since Unicron has always had his "bat wings" it would follow that others of the pantheon have wings of their own. The reason I mentioned seraphim wings is the pseudo glow/holographic look that they have reminded me of Collett Brunel (Funny joke I only recently got with that name I'll explain at the bottom in a P.S.) from Tales of Syphonia who through out the game is on a pilgrimage to become a Angel (Oddly not divine in nature but a extremely long lived and mystical race like Humans, Dwarves, and Elves. Enough mana in the right way will convert their race over even geneticly.) at one point he gains wings and unlike the only other Angel shown up to this point who has the classic bird style ones Collett's appear as six little butterfly like wings that don't actually attatch to her visibly and are see through like holograms came to mind. In a weird way for Primus, Solomus and Epistmus that kind of style really ties into their good aspects in Divine life and Unicron's classic shriveled bat wings are nice tie to his evil nature. But yeah the group look great with wings no matter how you want to look at it which I can only say smart planning on your part my friend it really sells it.
Thank you very much. I just don't like leaving my friends hanging is all.
P.S. Ok that whole joke about Collett Brunel in Tales of Symphonia has to do with another favorite subject of mine which is Railways. In Great Britain there were four regions for locomotive traffic back in the days of steam the largest railway to serve the western region was called the Great Western Railway and it was founded by a man named Isambard Kingdom Brunel, now at first glance this just seems coincidental as Brunel is a reasonably common name but the thing that seals it is that after founding the GWR Brunel was not only the railway controller but also it's chief mechanical engineer designing the Steam Locomotives of his railway and ensuring they did what he designed them for and eventually he retired and an new CME was appointed this would continue till the merger of the four regions into British Railways but along the way the last name of one of the CMEs was Collet a alternate spelling of the name for a lady. Japan really likes their trains it seems since someone at Namco-bandai thought it a clever joke to put into a video game.
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How did a discussion about a telling of Cybertron's origins turn into a discussion about T-Cogs? And in fairness, in TFP, Starscream flat out said that what they have is more biology than machinery, and given the replacement of his arm at one point, it could be considered akin to human prosthetics, where things like limbs can be replaced, but things like internal organs are a lot harder to do. And technically speaking, for the TFs, the T-Cog is an internal organ.
To sum it up about James Roberts and what he and other writers at IDW seem to be doing, I think part of it is the fact that the world we live in is becoming more and more secularized. As such, Primus is basically God for the TFs, and through their stories, both official and fanfic, the writers get to make some stories that question the validity of religion and the like. Plus, nowadays, the people behind a lot of films, shows, comics and books and what have you try to put their own messages forth about what they want to get across to the audience/readers. In this instance, I tend to get more of a heavy dosage of "RELIGION IS WRONG!!" with religious zealots often being used as antagonists with political power, characters like Primus being treated more like abstract concepts that may or may not be real, and plenty of other things as well.
Not to mention, a lot of the time, particularly in science fiction, religion is rarely ever portrayed in a positive light. While I get that in the real world not all religious people are good and some religious institutions can put ridiculous and harmful standards on various folks, that doesn't mean that that should be the ONLY depiction of religion that we get in ficition.
In past versions of Transformers, they often used the "All Myths Are True" trope, where every myth and legend was true. However, this time, they're not doing that.
As I've said, however, they don't really have an excuse for that anymore, as the universe IDW's created has real supernatural elements in it. Examples include, but are not limited to:
1. Rom the Spaceknight's enemies, the Dire Wraiths, a race of shape-shifting, parasitic, SPACE WIZARDS!!!!
2. The Infestation series where the universe was invaded by the Lovecraftian Elder Gods.
3. At present, there's a mini-series going on right now where the TFs have to contend with the Visionarries, a group of MAGIC-USERS!!
There's plenty of other examples, but those are the ones that stick out the most right now. So, if you have confirmed supernatural elements, then what's the point in having characters like Primus be fake? You might as well go all-out.
Give them enough time, though, and they'll probably say that it's some overly convoluted science that can't be explained right now. After all, there's Arthur C. Clarke's 3rd law, "Any technology that is sufficiently advanced enough is indiscernable from magic."
You're welcome.
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Forgive me when I get started on something I'm passionate about I can digress majorly. I just find that even though they are living robotic organism that biology and technology run very close to each other. Unlike a prosthetic Starscream's new arm was fully integrated into him to the point of him calling it a "New model" that to me means if they have the parts and training (Let's not let Wheeljack close to the operating table please. 
People may be going to church and the like less and less but Religon and Spirituality are not mutually exclusive. But it is true that things get challenged alot and Cybertron as old a civilization (Often as old as the galaxy it's self.) there is potential for a lot of members to question based off the science that had developed but at the same time I also feel that Cybertronians also have even more evidence to point towards the existence of higher power as well. Your quite right to feel that vibe from the writings in IDW I mean how many bots have said things like they don't believe in one thing or another? I mean even Optimus one who has the Matrix once said this and frankly I find that to be in poor taste seeing how much Optimus will see and learn plus the existence of Sparks kind of puts a major hurtle in the way for those who try that methodology in their writing there is mystical power at work and it can't be put down.
Ugh I also know what you mean there too. Tales of Symphonia a great RPG has a truly evil church thanks to it's founder but the intent of good is still there in a way with someone trying to bring balence and to keep the faith. That's just a example of a JRPG (and oddly one I've mentioned alot in my discussions with you. Funny that.) heck a older version of it was in Tron with the MCP keeping the faithful programs down even though it knew there were Users though it also saw we weren't as powerful as most programs thought Zelots are in a lot of contemporary fiction indeed but there are usually those who belong to the faith that feel that the truth is really there not pushing it on others but accepting there are other views indeed both sides need to be seen. Nothing in life is black and white there are various shades of Grey and that should be respected.
"All myths are true" can really be dangerous waters. A more applicable trope would be "All Myths have a grain of truth in them" But I see what you mean indeed.
Perfect examples right there. Heck anything with Lovecraftian influences has science and sorcery as the horrors like that are pure supernatural there is no inbetween on that except one example which was the Bionicle Character Treh Crom (Or close to that) He was really just a being the average mind couldn't look at without going bonkers due to his purely organic gelatinous form had this effect on the races of the Bionicle due to them being Biomechanical living beings. Heck getting back to that the Bionicle explained the masks with power with the material they were made our of being programable but the source of said material was supernatural and was even sentient since all forms of Protodermis were synthetic versions of the Protodermis at the center of Spherra Magna. Even more mystic was there was so many variants of the synthetic kind it bleeded over into the normal periodic elements.
I fully agree my friend. Primus should be the heart of Cybertron. The other three of the Guiding Hand maybe not but Primus indeed was real no matter what the writers try to say to the contrary.
Ha that old thing I got another law for it "Any technology no matter how advanced is magic to those who don't understand it." The're some things science can't explain it can tell us what is keeping us alive but can it tell us why and how. Some people think every question can be answered with research but there are just too many things in this world that simply cannot be without power beyond. Especially in stories there is always unexplained things and mystical and supernatural powers that work without explanation so I say screw Clark's Third law it shouldn't apply to worlds with established magic.
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Well, to be honest, that kind of thing never really bothered me, but I can understand where you're coming from.
Yeah, it is sad that IDW's treating it the way they are, but it's also sad that people are just eating it up. While I will admit that IDW's take does have some more sophistication than other versions, it tends to swing too far in one direction for my taste. Characters tend to be unlikeable jerks, everyone's always angry at each other, scheming is second nature to everyone, and stuff gets convoluted, although that last part is par for the course when it comes to long-running comics.
The thing is, what the writers and plenty of other people don't realize, or choose to deny, is that people are religious by nature. Everyone in some form or another worships something. Whether it be a higher power, a philosophy, an ideal, or even themselves, it's there, and nothing with ever change that, but I digress.
As for "All Myths Are True," that's kind of the nature of some comics, particularly the big 2; Marvel and DC. In those universes, every religion, myth, and legend is true, and all the gods and supernatural beings exist.
Glad you agree with my examples. Although, someone would probably argue that the Lovecraftian one doesn't count since H.P. Lovecraft was one of the earliest writers to use the "Doing In The Wizard" trope, where something that was previously established as mystical is later retconned as having a scientific explanation. After all, in his works, the Outer Gods and Great Old Ones are actually aliens, magical incantations are actually mathematical formulae, there are time-travelers, interdimensional beings, and time-traveling aliens. The fact that Lovecraft was a staunch Atheist probably adds to that as well.
Personally, I like the idea of Primus not only being Cybertron's core but also having Cybertron be his alt. mode.
Perhaps, but that still renders magic as a form of technology. Marvel seems to be going that route these days, since the first Thor movie had the titular character say, "Your ancestors called it magic and you call it science. I come from a place where they're one and the same." Still, they've got the movie version of Dr. Strange, who is a real magic-user, and the executives at Marvel have said that it's okay for magic to be contrary to the laws of science.
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Fair enough my friend. After all we all have our personal tastes and I can respect that yours isn't annoyed by something I am. Honestly I love Prime to bits recently bought the full DVD set just so I could own a proper copy (By the time I watched or even heard of Prime The Hub had long been gone and the show over. I had a major part of 2009 through to 2011 where I barely did anything due to my depression over my mother passing) and all it's only one small thing that bothers me and it adds fuel to my writing for my universe Triple Changers have to come from some mad science. Speaking of I have a question on a color scheme for a certain bot I'll add it to my reply to your note though.
That is a very wise view of things my friend and a absolutely correct one. No matter where you go humans have something they thank for good fortune, health, even material possessions. No matter where you stand on who or what your regard as the highest power there is still worship and it's part of our nature.
Ah but "All myths are true" has a major parodox to it. Some myths of other cultures literally cancels out anothers. A example dragons being beasts in Europe and the US when they are enlightened kings in Japan, Every Pharaoh becomes a divine when they die, World shaking events are rendered null by another's. With the other system it allows all deitys, Magic and stories to have happened or exist without the parodoxical clashing.
"Every party needs a pooper." If he was so against the ideology of a higher power then he wouldn't of created creatures capable of taking a soul apart bit by bit like it was made of legos put it back together another way see the result and do it ad infinitum till they get bord and toss it back to the mortal plain out of disinterest like a child a toy they grew out of. The things those abominations can do is not math, it's not science it's magic. Unlike a character like say Batmite and Mr. Ican'tspellhisname who come from a higher dimensional plane and so they see the corners that can be cut in our 3rd dimension these things can do this to anything and that means higher powered magic of a divine level I won't settle for the chants being Math or otherworldly Binary it's magic and he just did that to spite others.
Oh I agree I mean even in my story Primus can become robot mode in times of great need his brother in my universe spends more time in bot mode as is. I'm even making it clear how his transformation doesn't destroy any buildings on Cybertron his body has plates like those of Earth's Tectonic ones as the surface changes these plates move to make sure every thing is lined up incase of transformation. It's reflexive too so Primus' semisleep is not affected by it any more than ours would by breathing also Primus and Unicron have a power I call Space Walk for the moment which literally allows them to intuitively walk on the nothing of space.
Unless you can explain it it's magic. That is the whole point of that quote which I got from a web comic call Freefall quite a neat Sci-fi series with some interesting concepts on AI growth in man made machines both Genetic and robotic as well as questioning Asmov's three rules. I know it's not what Thor meant in that case but imagine using a electro magnet infront of someone in Salem at the time of the Witch hunts to them that would be magic and a instant death sentence so his powers can have connection to both after all His hammer has a Neutron Star at it's heart which give him the magic and power in the other stories I've seen but like you say Dr. Strange doesn't play by the laws of science ever he is beyond a shadow of a doubt the one Marvel hero who you can't say is just using natural energys in a way that look magical. He literally has magic and can shatter Newtons Laws in a billion ways heck he could bend space like it's a book and be on another planet it can't be explained how he just jumped to another world in the time it takes you to sneeze when light takes 4 years to get to.
Spacebridges can do it with science since that's more or less stable wormhole creation but like I said Strange literally walked that distance in a instant by pulling the planet closer to him like you would turn a page in a book. There is not science there just Magic.
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Yeah, Prime is easily my favorite version thus far, despite a few little gripes I have with it, among them being the whole "Unicron is Earth" thing. And sorry to hear about your mom, dude. My condolences.
Glad we agree on the fact that religiosity is a natural thing. Though like I said, there are plenty who would deny it.
True, they do tend to play around a bit with just how the myths are true, and a lot of religions contradict each other with their teachings.
Well, about Lovecraft, I think it had something to with his upbringing, I guess. He was a shut-in as a kid and had a phobia of other people, especially non-whites, although that part was probably due in part to the time period he lived in. Anyway, the theme of Lovecraftian horror is hopelessness, insignificance, that we are so tiny and unimportant in the grand scheme of things, and that we will all be either destroyed, consumed, or turned into mindless slaves by beings that we can't even begin to comprehend. It's complicated, I guess. He probably just thought it would make for a good story. The thing is, Lewis Lovhaug aka Linkara actually deconstructed this type of story in some of his videos, showcasing that the cosmic horror beings would be just as insignificant as us.
Sounds like a good plan.
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