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Cocoroll — Heart Bokehs
#asriel #chara #undertale #dreemurr
Published: 2016-01-30 16:31:56 +0000 UTC; Views: 25367; Favourites: 1048; Downloads: 149
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Chara and Asriel doodle~ I like to think about their living times. Chara probably has at least a little good side otherwise Asriel wouldn't have valued their friendship this much ..right?Related content
Comments: 59
its the little dot-light effect you see floating around them.
think of blurred city pictures and how the lights show up as little glowing dots.
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chara really doesn't identify as a boy or a girl, so you should rewrite that as ''Two cute siblings.''
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'Chara probably has at least a little good side otherwise Asriel wouldn't have valued their friendship this much ..right?'
It's possible, but we don't know much....so I'll say yes. You do have a point.
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More of an Friskriel fan myself
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I don't see Chara as a bad person actually! They're just misunderstood! Because if you think about it, everything about Chara in the game can either point to that they're very sacrificing and is really misunderstood, or malenovent, which I believe they're the former.
And oh my god that is absolutely gorgeous! ;w;
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Yes, because nothing says misunderstood like genocide
But, yeah, she's gone through a lot of shit and was cute and innocent once, but let's face it. No one in this game is really innocent (except Papyrus. He's precious)
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I'm not sure which genocide you are refering to, the attempted one against the Humans, or the actual one against the Monsters, so I'll argue both.
For the Humans, it was pretty much them or the Monsters. Many people believed that it was pointless for teh Monsters to even try breaking out, cause if they did the Humans would just kill them all. That, combined with Chara's less than stellar opinion of Humanity, meant that cohabitation was not see as an option. So either they could let Monsterkind be forever trapped in the Underground, ever having less and less space to live in, or they could do something, free their new family and everyone else from the prison the evil Humans put them in after slaughtering a large number of them. Plus, who knows if they even intended full on genocide, might have stopped at the one village, having claimed land for the monsters and use the gathered power to make sure no-one even thinks about attacking.
For the monsters, Chara didn't do that. In an often overlooked line, they straight up say that at hte beginning they had no idea what's going on and why they weren't dead, and that you taught them the purpose of their reincarnation. They learned it because of what you did, which was genocide, killing everyone you met, including their adopted mom. So yeah, they were dragged through pretty much hell and came up worse for it.
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I never said she committed genocide against monsters. I said she committed genocide. Erasing the world is technically killing everyone. Now, I'm not saying she just did this for evil reasons. Imagine you're chara. Your best friend and brother "betrayed" her, and she's dead, lying under a bunch of flowers with sticky seeds for god knows how long. Then, you're waked up by a human falling on your grave. As you said, you don't have a stellar opinion on humans, but you don't exactly have much left to do, so you tag along. You translate what the Froggits and other monsters mean, hoping the human might understand them better. But then the human starts killing. You see it kill every monster you know, even your mother. Eventually, the little brat has killed the vast majority of the underground, pushing you over the edge. If this human kills all monsters, you might as well finish the job and let the humans suffer as well, erasing the world.
Does this excuse her commiting genocide against humans and the remaining monsters? No, it does not, but it does make her more of a three dimensional "villain"
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Mmhmm I totally agree <3
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I don't see Chara as bad at all :c
This video explains how I see them ^_^ it shows Chara as good and I really like that.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYHXpd…
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Hmm.. I think they judge Chara as all good from such small information. But I agree with some of their points c: especially that Chara wants to save Asriel in Pacific run~
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Very cute! I love the colors and how you drew the clouds.
My thoughts on Chara (without taking the meta meaning that Chara is YOU into account) are that he/she was a sociopath. Often, socio (psycho) paths are very friendly and can completely mimic a "normal" person. It's a form of manipulation, whether or not the socio realizes he's doing it. Chara probably knew well she/he was doing it given the whole plan to destroy humanity.
At the very least, their sibling-hood was probably a toxic relationship. I've had a friendship like that once. I was his friend, but every day he'd find ways to bring me down and be negative. Couple that with a side of Depression and it was living hell that I willingly walked into everyday in class because I was so lonely and we had a lot of interests in common. When someone like that comes along, it's like a vampire's trance. You want to fall under it, but it drains you until there's less left of you in the end.
Sorry, that was long-winded and depressing. But hey, Asriel and Chara's story is also rather long and depressing.
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Here you go for your pleasure of listening Here
Personally, I see Chara as just a misunderstood person. I don't know if you believe in the Narrachara theory, but what we see of Chara at the end of the genocide route is really not a good portrait of their overall personality. And the tapes can be very misleading, even Asriel claims them to be "not the greatest person". But even then, I believe there are traces all over the game that Chara - they may not be an angel like frisk, but - does actually care about those they loved. I do not want to make this wall of text even longer, but the main proof can be seen when Asriel tries so hard to not let Chara go, and even Asgore and Toriel held something in memorial for Chara. In the very least, I believe they care about their family.
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I saw the video between my post and your response actually. It did change a lot of my views on Chara (I'd heard fan talk that Chara was abused but never found evidence myself), but I still think they had empathy issues or at the very least had learned to be violent from the surface and thought that was the only way to get things done. This does not mean that Chara was a bad person. They were just a person who needed mental help and didn't get it in our often cruel, unforgiving world. All Chara wanted was control of their own life.
I still hold by my view that when Asriel says Chara wasn't "the nicest person" that this meant Chara would be somewhat mean to him. Why else would he, as Flowey, mention that Chara wouldn't give him any "worthless pity?" This sounds like stuff a little sibling learns to say from a mean older brother/sister who manipulates or harms them.
Also, thanks to another video I watched, I believe that Frisk is Chara re-incarnated, not that Chara was "awoken" by Frisk falling on their grave or Frisk's determination alone. The player decides whether to lead Frisk to mercy or murder. The former path leads Chara and Asriel finding peace in their respective reincarnated forms. The latter leads to Chara and Asriel reinforcing their old beliefs that the world is "kill or be killed." Asgore and Asriel both mention that Frisk reminds them of Chara, both humans share the same soul color, and Chara's memories and narration seem to be coming from within Frisk. Why? Because they're the same soul. This makes it all the more tragic that Asriel says Frisk is the friend he wishes he'd had all along. Chara is there, listening, as their brother admits they like Frisk better.
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Now your views are very similiar to mine. C: The only difference is that I believe Chara was just that kind of person who seems distant and strong, because of their surface life, so the way they treated others is of a person who have been mentally hurt(even physically hurt) versus the way Asriel was accustomed to have being treated by monsters who are extremely kind.
I may not support that theory much, but that would be painful even in the NarraChara theory, especially with all they did for Asriel and their family. ;w;
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That's possible too. We all make projections of ourselves and our experiences on Chara and Frisk. Given my family's history with mental disorders and stigma, I probably read more into that than I should.
Yup. Asriel needed to get that out of his system, but it was still a painful thing to say… especially to someone who's listening.
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Yeah, that's true. But one thing is sure, that Chara suffered a lot. ;w;
I believe it probably pained him to say that too, but you're right, he had to get that out of his system. Even then, think about how painful it is for Chara to realized Frisk, who was practically a stranger to Asriel, is what he wants as a friend over them, who went through almost everything together with him.
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I know, right? It's not like you can say that he cared about Frisk as anything more than a toy as Flowey, so he's basically saying some kind stranger is a better friend than his own sibling. Kind of being a jerk there, Goatbro.
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Yeah, he just goes "oh my sibling-slash-bestfriend whom I lived with and died to free mosterkind is not as good as this stranger I met as a soulless flower whom I toyed with but I want them as my sibling-slash-bestfriend instead of Chara" That's the only thing that prevent me from seeing him as the lovely goatbro there lmao.
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I love Asriel, but I don't think he's the innocent character the fandom portrays him as. Sure, he was a kid–so was Chara–but he totally went along with a plan that involved killing six humans for their souls. While he was soulless as Flowey, he still did awful things to everybody because he was bored and should be held somewhat responsible for his actions. It always baffles me that people are ready to forgive Asriel and all his misdeeds when Chara didn't actually succeed in killing anybody unless you take the No Mercy route and interpret Chara as directly helping you kill everyone. -_-
Wow. We're really turning this into a fan discussion, aren't we?
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Well, the good thing about him is he's cute--but yeah, in truth in his subconscious he wanted, and did all the deeds he did when he was Flowey. It's not like anyone forced him to, it's his doings by his own pure violation. And here people just goes, whoosh Asriel's a bab and we forgive you, while Chara is just, oh my god don't even let me started. People really doesn't get the concept of Undertale did they, no one has to be the villian in Undertale, yet Chara ended up as a scapegoat. And goatbro just goes, ayyyy lmao when he's actually the tangible villian right there. And did you see how many inhumane Chara fanmade boss fights are out there? I'm just speechless.
Yep, but I'm enjoying this. XD do you?
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I think the fact that everyone wants to pin Chara as the villain shows us something about human nature. We have to blame someone for the bad things to not be held accountable for our actions (and Chara totally calls you out on it). I don't know if you've seen the musical "Into the Woods," but there's a part where all the characters start blaming each other for a series of deaths that have happened and ultimately turn on a character who's a witch. She in turn explains that to everybody involved the story, that's all that matters–find somebody to blame–and that the other characters aren't good or bad, just nice. She's singled out because she's "not good, not nice, just right."
I'm enjoying this too. Just thought I'd point it out.
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I watched that! :0 Now that you reminded me of that scene, that's true. And another thing I have heard quite sometime ago is that humans have a habit of pinpointing things good or bad like black or white, like an act or intention is either all good or all bad, no inbetween, which happens very rarely. Infact, even if Chara was to blame (something I'll argue over till the end of time lolol--) what they did is not good or bad, it's something in between. Even with their act in the genocide ending (not counting the nonsensical interpretation where they make Frisk kills) it's just them stopping us and being educated and guided by us. Buuuut here we are with people practically worshipping Asriel and turns Chara into a sociopathic murderer.
It's really fun to do a fan talk like this sometimes. C:
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The whole good and bad/black and white thing is exactly what I'm talking about. I love "Into the Woods" for its deep stuff like that because it takes the fairy tale narrative of good and bad and turns it on its head. If you've only seen the movie version though, the play is more meta. There's a part where the characters turn on the narrator and sacrifice him/her to the giant–which they only realize was wrong too late. Kind of reminds me of that too. Human nature stuff.
Yup. Asriel worship annoys me, and I say that with him being one of my favorite characters. The fact that he's NOT the angelic baby monster everyone makes him out to be makes him an interesting character. We all can fall into the traps of human curiosity when given an excuse (in his case the ability to reset in our case playing a video game). It kind of bugs me when everyone talks about Asriel and Flowey as separate entities for this. They are, but they're not.
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It was a long time since I watch the movie, so please excuse me if my memory is a little hazy. ;w; Into the woods does really play with human thought and conscience though, some thing only Chara seems to show in Undertale actually.
People doesn't really appreciate the idea that Asriel is not an absolute angel it seems, despite the dimension it gives to a character. Not to mention Flowey is just Asriel who lacks compassion, so surely his thought process and curiosity are the same? We all are a victim of human curiosity (monster curiosity in his case?) and these can be use as an excuse, but that doesn't mean it can be use to separate Asriel from Flowey and vice versa, and yep it bugs me too.
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No worries. I've been an "Into the Woods" fan for… wow. It's been almost a decade since I first listened to the show soundtrack. I feel old! Both "Into the Woods" and "Undertale" play with their medium (stage shows/fairy tales and video games) to get the audience to think about human nature. Chara definitely has a lot to say about it. I'm tempted to say Sans comments on human nature too, but I think that depends on how you interpret him. He definitely knows about the player's desire to complete the Merciless Route just because they can.
Yup. I like a character who has done bad things–even truly awful things–and still is sympathetic more than purely good or evil. The lack of a soul is just an excuse. After all, if Flowey had the ability to absorb monster souls and that would turn him back into Asriel, why didn't he try that before? He's played with the timelines a lot more than we have. Did he just never think of that?
Going back to Sans again (since "Undertale" has become more like "Sanstale" with the fandom) this is the same reason I don't understand how people miss the fact that Sans doesn't like humans–he maybe even hates them. The only reason he doesn't kill Frisk/Chara outright is because Toriel asked him not to. He only cares about one human thanks to the player going above and beyond to be kind to monsters and keep his world one without killing.
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A decade? That's some dedication isn't it? XD And what you said is right, at first I was about to mention Sans too, but I realized one thing mid typing, it's that Sans is only reprimanding Frisk(the player) or either being very vengeful, even if he did try to stop us, but Chara actually reinforces the "consequences" of playing the genocide route. And complete with the way they address us, I think they're the most glaringly disturbing things in the genocide run.
Exactly. And even if he can't do that, I believe he's actually pretty smart, as seen as when he's Flowey, and could probably figure out ways to return to his normal form, but his curiosity got the best of him and the events of Undertale happened. Asriel basically decided to toy with others instead of doing what could be consider morally appropriate, is that not a dead giveaway enough that he's not all angel and fluff?
Sanstale yes XDDD And for this, I mean no offense, but I believe all the people in is fandom on the younger spectrum have all fallen for Sans lmao. But I agree, Sans is not, by any means, a forgiving guy or a kind person. It's just an extreme case of ooc fandom-wide, especially when the character we're talking about is the sweetheart of the fandom that people seems to think is the hero in the end or something. In all honesty, Sans is borderline an antihero, and that doesn't really make things better when the fandom thinks of him a cool, protective guy.
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Sorry for the long wait replying. I may be perpetually logged in, but active I'm not.
Yeah. It seems like yesterday I was listening to the recording on a hand-me-down tape player.
I'm a little confused. Is Chara the disturbing one or Sans? Or both?
Yup. That video about Chara really made a good point that really we can relate most to Flowey/Asriel when we play the game multiple times. Only Asriel knows of the experience of messing with things in the game just out of boredom. I mean, he's a kid, but he still had practically eternity to look for solutions to his and others' problems apart from taking the human souls to break the barrier to do… god knows what.
I totally agree. I love the skellybros (admittedly Sans more than Papyrus) but the Dreemurrs are my favorite characters. People like Sans for… well, admittedly a lot of good reasons, but it's just like the Asriel fans. "Let's only see the good and blame somebody else for the bad!" I see the same stuff with people who hate Asgore and think Toriel is a saint–actually I could write a decent blog on those people, but I think I've typed enough for today's comment. The main reason I like Sans is because he acts exactly like I did when I've had major depressive episodes: keep smiling, keep happy and joking, even if on the inside, you KNOW everything is pointless. It's not a pretty picture and that's how I like it.
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No problem. c: I was busy nowadays too, life and stuff. ;w; I miss those old times too <3 ;w;
I meant Chara, because let's be honest here, who gets disturbed by Sans' appearance in the genocide run anyway? XD
Yes exactly. Asriel is kind of a douchebag actually if you think about it now-- He's possibly very omnipotent and all he did was toying others around. We can relate to Asriel/Flowey yes, but in an extremely insensitive way. He did have the choice on how to proceed with his own way, with no exact goals in mind except maybe to wait for Chara to come back(?), but Frisk(the player) has only one goal in mind; escaping from the underground. I think you get what I'm saying, that Flowey got more chance to just rescue himself, unlike Frisk who have a task on their hands.
Sans god what did you do-- But yeah you're right. Especially on the "Let's only see the good and blame somebody else for the bad!", it's really the accurate portraying of this fandom really. And also that hate Asgore issue, it's just ughhhh what did goatdad ever did to you?! I admitted at first I was so suspicious of him but his pain and all the things he went through is just horrible. Toriel is not that saintly either, the fandom needs to realize that. Speaking about depression, I think I resembled Flowey more than Sans when I got that. Not the toying with people part, but the apathetic part, pretty strange for depression, right?
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Well, I will say that it's amazing how just removing the highlights in Sans' eye sockets makes him unsettling. *Insert spooky scary skeletons joke here*
I think Flowey/Asriel did have a goal after enough resets. He wanted to get the human souls. He mentions that Asgore "won't show them" to him despite everything he's done and when Asgore dies in a Neutral run, those are the first thing Flowey goes for. I think he wanted to see what kind of power he'd have but also to break the barrier and cause more destruction outside. When Frisk showed up and had the save/reset abilities, Asriel thought he'd found a new toy.
Depression is different in everybody. Apathy is one possible reaction because you are unable to feel positive emotions or have any desire to do anything. I have a friend who completely shut down and was unable to do anything constructive after something really traumatic happened to her. For me, I'm Type II Bipolar, so most of the time I'm sleepy, sad, and getting from day to day, but on occasion, I'm inspired and excited to get something done (which means I don't sleep… so I'm more sleepy the next day).
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Sorry for not replying in so long! I've just got time now, sorry again! qwq
Sans is a mysterious character...now I wonder would Papyrus looks scary also if we removed the highlights in his eyes.
Ah, yes, how did I forget that. He wanted to see what kind of power he'd have and what destruction he can caused? That is quite power hungry, even for Asriel, but then again, does compassion halt ambition? Now that I think about it, he must've been pretty tired of everything now to just let go of his and Chara's original goal. From freeing everyone, to how much destruction he can caused. And Frisk falling down is probably a good thing that happened to him - at least, good for his mental health.
Ah I see. Mental problems did really have a varied possible responses depending on each people. My friend/acquaintance also have mild Bipolar (which type, I do not quite remember. I'll ask them later) and depression, and they have a similar reaction to you. Something like this really shouldn't happen to anyone at all. No one deserves to go through it. qwq
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No worries. I wasn't even planning to use my computer today so it might have been a few days before I read this.
Well, that's just my interpretation of what Asriel/Flowey wanted with the souls. I mean, if he only wanted to break the barrier, why did he fight us in that insane battle? I mean, I guess he just hates Frisk having the abilities to save and reload so much and was used to killing monsters over and over again for fun. Eh. It was probably just something new for him to do.
Yup. Mental disorders suck. When I was diagnosed last year I flipped out because I had my own stigmas about Bipolar Disorder. Thankfully I haven't had anyone call me anything bad yet, but it was hilarious in a dark way that some family and coworkers said that I was "the happiest person they knew" or I "never get angry" when I would explain what I was going through. It shows you how people don't/won't see it.
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Seems like there's always a week or so pause on my side, sorry again!
The game portrayed him as very eager to take over all the human souls, but didn't exactly state his purpose does it? Flowey sure hated Frisk, but I'm not sure about does he still shares the same ideal as Chara and his old self, so judging him later onwards is kind of hard. Especially with all the more evident things in him. If he does, however, share those same old ideals, his lack of empathy would probably mean he's going to wreck havoc anyway.
Most people aren't as observant as we thought. I found out that when I went through a hard time, rather than people noticing something's off, they assumed I got colder, how strange. But at least they didn't call you anything bad. People could get a hell lot more awful and it's good we (at least to what I assumed) didn't have to go through it.
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Like I said before, no worries. I don't always get online either.
Nope, it doesn't. Maybe he's just bored and wants to see what would happen if he got them.
So, they thought you were just trying to push them away? That's still kind of mean, but I get why they'd think that. And yes, people can be very mean when they don't understand something. I still have problems with fearing mental illness, but I'm trying to get better. Telling someone that you have a mental disorder can bring out their stigma against it.
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Thanks. qwq
Hopefully he is just bored, because if he active searches for stuff to destroy then it's a whole new story.
Yeah, but I guess that's to be expected. First impressions can be horrifying, and I believed we were both left with scars, varying in severity, that is. People can easily assume things for the worse, after all, no matter the pain it caused them and others. At least that would make us learn to be more accepting of things.
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I forgot a piece of dialogue Flowey says in the Genocide run (I haven't actually played that route yet… but I will for writing purposes. 
Yup. Sometimes the scars decide to open up though. It's not something you mend, it's something you treat. A toxic person (like my boss, sadly) or a bad memory can bring me back to that depressive state for a day. Mania has only happened a couple of times but it's terrifying. I hope you've healed better than I have. It's been a battle.
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Genocide run is a heart aching and deary run to play after the happy ending of the pacifist run. But welp, Flowey definitely has a power complex, if we can call it that.
I totally agree, it's a painstaking process of healing, which sometimes is successful, or sometimes fails, over and over again until things died down in your mind. I've never had a mania or panic attack/episode, so I probably can't appropriately sympathize, but it must've been awful. My depression period appears certainly mild in comparison to what you've been going through, I can't deny my recovery path must've been more lenient than yours, and I can't offer any condolences other than good luck, I wished things were easier on your end.
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You should watch the video from Judgement Boy.
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