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OokamiKasumi — Strong Characters but a Weak Plot?

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Published: 2016-02-24 16:33:17 +0000 UTC; Views: 12383; Favourites: 284; Downloads: 0
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Description ----- Original Message -----
...I have very strong characters, but a very weak plot. While my story is primarily character driven, I feel I feel I put them in a place where there's not much plot, or that the plot itself is uninteresting. How do make my plot stronger? Furthermore, how do I find a balance between plot and characters? Or is it okay that my plot isn't gripping, as long as I have strong, well-developed characters?

What should you do when you have
Strong Characters but a Weak Plot?
First, I think we should clarify what Character-Driven means.
Character-Driven does NOT mean:
A story that focuses on the characters.
Character-Driven means:
-- A story's events happen because the characters choose (or refuse) to make things happen. In other words; the story's Plot is Driven by the events caused by the characters.

Examples of Character-Driven stories:
-- 'Hero' stories where the character volunteers to be a hero such as Iron Man, Batman, the Harry Potter series, How to Train your Dragon, and most Romance stories such as; Miss Congeniality, Secretary, Pride & Prejudice.

In comparison:

Plot-Driven means:
-- A story's events happen because the world around the characters makes things happen to the characters. In other words; the story's Plot is Driven by the events happening to the characters.

Examples of Plot-Driven stories:
-- Hero stories where the hero is pushed into being a hero whether they want to or not such as Spiderman, Pitch Black, most broad-range High fantasy stories such as The Sandman graphic novel series, The Wheel of Time, The Sword of Shannara, Lord of the Rings books and movies, and most Science-Fiction such as Brave New World, Equilibrium, The Matrix, Soylant Green, Star Trek, Babylon 5, Battlestar Galactica.

To simplify:
   If the Characters make things happen to each other and/or the World around them it's Character-Driven.
   If the World around them makes things happen to the Characters it's Plot-Driven.

Now that we have that straight, on with your questions!
  ----- Original Message -----
How do make my plot stronger? Furthermore, how do I find a balance between plot and characters? Or is it okay that my plot isn't gripping, as long as I have strong, well-developed characters?
Let's start with this:
  ----- Original Message -----
Is it okay that my plot isn't gripping, as long as I have strong, well-developed characters?
NO, it's Not Okay.
-- No matter how interesting your characters are, if they're in a boring story your characters will seem boring too. To show off interesting characters, they have to DO interesting things. A cool back-story is Not Enough.

Example:
-- Batman, Spiderman, and Iron man were fishing on the bank of a river. As a result of the smart-assed comments passed around between them, an argument broke out over whose superpower was best. To decide, each one one caught a fish using their superpowers. Still unable to decide, they went home.

Boring.

Why? Because even though we had 3 interesting and engaging superheroes, they didn't really do anything but fish. Sure, the dialogue between them was probably pretty awesome, but honestly? You could have told the same story with 3 old men, 3 little kids, or 3 grannies. In fact it actually would have been a better story if the 3 old men, 3 little kids, or 3 grannies had used superpowers to fish.

Those three superheroes were WASTED on this story.

To put it bluntly:
If you're going to use super characters, you need a super Story to show them off.
   ----- Original Message -----
How do make my plot stronger? Furthermore, how do I find a balance between plot and characters?
To Make a PLOT Stronger: Add More Problems for Them to Solve.
AKA: Add More CONFLICTS.
-- In other words...
What's the Worst Thing that could happen? Make that happen! (Murphy's Law)

So where do you Get this "Worse Thing That could happen?"
-- From your Characters.

Begin here...

Who are your 3 Main Characters?
-- This doesn't mean you can't have a huge cast of characters! Simply that these are the 3 that the main story focuses on.

   the Main character:
   the Ally or Middle-man character:
   the Villain or Trouble-maker character:

Examples from Anime:

In Hellsing (Plot-Driven) the 3 characters are thus:

   the Main character: Sir Integra Hellsing
   the Ally or Middle-man character: Seres Victoria
   the Villain or Trouble-maker character: Alucard

Until an actual Villain is added, then the cast changes to:

   the Main character: Alucard
   the Ally or Middle-man character: either Sir Integra OR Seres Victoria; depending on the scene they're in.
   the Villain or Trouble-maker character: Guest Villain

In Full Metal Alchemist (sometimes Plot-driven, sometimes Character-driven depending on the episode,) the 3 characters are thus:

   the Main character: Edward Elric
   the Ally or Middle-man character: Alphonse Elric
   the Villain or Trouble-maker character: Colonel Mustang

Until an actual Villain is added, then the cast changes to:

   the Main character: Edward Elric
   the Ally or Middle-man character: Alphonse Elric, Colonel Mustang, or guest Victim
   the Villain or Trouble-maker character: Guest Villain

Keep in mind that Hellsing and Full Metal Alchemist are both Series stories so new characters are constantly being introduced as Victims (Ally characters) and as Villains to expand the story.

The idea behind all this is:
The better you know your Characters' Problems, the easier it is to make MORE Problems for them to solve.

In Traditional (and Bodice-Ripper) Romances the roles change drastically.
In a Romance, the 3 Main Characters look like thus:

   the Main character: Heroine
   the Ally or Middle-man character: His best friend and/or Her best friend.
   the Villain or Trouble-maker character: Hero

These Romances are traditionally told from the Female point of view and the Heroine does Not initiate the romance --or hardly anything else-- the Male character does. This is because these stories were invented (and codified) during the 1700's and 1800's where a female that was 'forward' about her affections was considered to be 'impolite', 'pushy' and low-class. Since most of these stories featured high-society females; lost princesses, impoverished Ladies, and down-trodden heiresses, being 'pushy' was not something they would do. Only female Villains acted that way.

Keep in mind that the original romances were written by 18th and 19th century middle-class authors Fantasizing about how they thought high-class noble ladies would act. It proved so popular an 'ideal' that this fantasy of nobility persists today.

So! If the Heroine never initiated the first move, How did Romance happen?
-- It started with some sort of Event where the two crossed paths, and the Hero decided that he wanted the Lady's . . . company, (think: Cinderella.) The rest of the story consisted of the many ways the Heroine sought to 'escape his clutches' until he finally rescues her from some sort of mortal peril and confesses his love. She then decides that she loves him. He fixes the story's major conflict and Cue: Happily Ever After.

Traditional Romance in detail:

   1) They cross paths during an Event. (Normally during an attempt to deal with her Problem.)
   2) He decides he wants her . . . company. (Despite certain personal problems.)
   3) She decides she wants nothing to do with him. (She has her own problems.)
   4) He seeks to get her into his clutches.
   5) She escapes -- repeatedly. (Sometimes before he catches her, sometimes after. If After: insert bodice-ripping love scene.)
   6) She falls into mortal peril. (While attempting to fix her own problem.)
   7) He rescues her and confesses his love. (Insert: Major Love Scene.)
   8) She decides that she's in love. (Or that she's been in love since their first encounter.)
   9) He voluntarily fixes her problem for her, as a wedding gift.
   10) Marriage and Happily Ever After.

Unfortunately, I am not exaggerating, the plots really were this simple, (and that sexist; the Hero does all the heavy-lifting.)

Modern Romances are a tad bit Different.
More Modern Romances have the Heroine rescue the Hero (or they rescue each other) from some sort of mortal peril at the center of the story, and during this discovers that she loves him. Even so, she still runs from his 'clutches' for quite a bit until he admits that he loves her. Deciding to fight together, they solve the story's major conflicts and Cue: Happily Ever After.

Modern Romance in detail:

   1) They cross paths during an Event. (Normally during an attempt to deal with her Problem.)
   2) He decides he wants her . . . company. (Despite certain personal problems.)
   3) She decides she wants nothing to do with him. (She has her own problems.)
   4) He seeks to get her into his clutches. (Insert: Seduction Scene.)
   5) She escapes -- repeatedly. (Sometimes before he catches her, sometimes after. If After: insert love scene.)
   6) He or They Both fall into mortal peril. (While attempting to fix their own problems.)
   7) She rescues Him or they rescue Each Other. (Insert: Major Love Scene.)
   8) She decides that she's in love, or that she's been in love since their first encounter, but still runs from him.
   9) At next encounter, he admits that he's in Love. Cue: Double Confession and they find a way to fix their problems Together.
   10) Happily Ever After or Happily For Now.

Yaoi Romances tend to have a bit more in common with Bodice-Ripper Romances.
They generally start with some sort of Event where the two cross paths, and both are immediately attracted to each other. One decides that they will do anything to have the other's . . . company. The next part of the of the story consists of the many ways the Pursued seeks to 'escape his Pursuer's clutches'. At the center of the story, The Pursuer rescues the Pursued from some sort of Peril and takes that chance to reinstate his attraction, usually forcefully. During this time the Pursued admits to themselves that it might be more than mere Attraction. It might be love. (Oh Noes!) Cue more running from 'clutches' until the pursuer admits that they're in Love. Insert Double Confession. Deciding to fight together, they solve the story's major conflicts and Cue: Happily Ever After.

Yaoi Romance in detail:

   1) They cross paths during an Event. (Normally during an attempt of each dealing with a Problem.)
   2) One decides he wants the Other's . . . company, usually with a stolen Kiss. (Despite certain personal problems.)
   3) The Pursued decides he wants nothing to do with his Pursuer. (He has his own personal problems.)
   4) The Pursuer gets the Pursued into his clutches. (Insert: Seduction Scene.)
   5) The Pursued escapes -- repeatedly. (Sometimes before he catches him, sometimes after. If After: Insert aggressive love scene.)
   6) One or the Other or They Both fall into mortal peril. (While attempting to fix their own problems.)
   7) The Pursued rescues their Pursuer, or they rescue Each Other. (Insert: Major Love Scene.)
   8) The Pursued decides that they're in love, or that they've been in love since the first encounter, but still runs from their Pursuer.
   9) At next encounter, the Pursuer admits that he's in Love. Cue: Double Confession, and they find a way to fix their problems Together.
   10) Happily Ever After or Happily For Now.

So...! What should you do with Your cast of characters?
Once you decide who your 3 Main Characters are:

   the Main character:
   the Ally or Middle-man character:
   the Villain or Trouble-maker character:

Ask EACH character these 3 questions:

   1. Who am I, and what do I do?
   2. What do I want?
   3. What is the Worst thing that could happen to me?

Once you know the answers to these three questions, you pretty much have your whole story.

   By combining the 1's you have the Opening scene to your story.
   By combining the 2's you have your External Conflicts scenes (what the character DO and what happens TO the characters,) and your Internal Conflict scenes (how they Feel about what's happening.)
   By combining the 3's you have your Main Character's Ordeal/Self-Sacrifice scene; the one thing they don't want to do, but have to (often to survive,) and your potential Climax scene.

Do not be afraid to change things around or adjust things to suit the story you want to tell.

Do Not Forget...!
A story cannot END until the Main character's problem AND the Ally character's problem have been Solved!

Fini

DISCLAIMER: As with all advice, take what you can use and throw out the rest. As a multi-published author, I have been taught some fairly rigid rules on what is publishable and what is not. If my rather straight-laced (and occasionally snotty,) advice does not suit your creative style, by all means, IGNORE IT.
Related content
Comments: 37

ErinDonnithorne [2019-12-04 10:15:54 +0000 UTC]

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AndroolG [2016-09-26 18:27:59 +0000 UTC]

I disagree.

I made story without any plot at all or very weak alibi plot in PnP rpg in the past that where amongst the preferred of my players because theirs characters were free to show there true colours not leaded by a story and trying to solve it. Obviously it's harder in a writed text since your character don't have free will and you have to make them do things without a plot that lead them but a slice of life story can have no plot and more style than the best plot stories.

Some very good book are known for their strong plot, other for the very well depicted scenery, other for a very deep character psychology. Most of the best authors in writing history weren't the best at everything and it was ok for them not to be because they had a deeper understanding of other facets of writing.

Not having everything on top is part of an artist style.

I was astonished when I heard a critic say he didn't like props movies when talking of a Tim Burton movie. Of course he was right but for me Tim Burton even if he is better at creating a mood than a story or a plot, he still is a genius. So yes if you are really strong at something, it is ok to be weak somewhere else.

I know of course that what you say in the end is "you have to work your weak points" and you are right of course. But the real answer is yes it can be ok.

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OokamiKasumi In reply to AndroolG [2020-02-19 00:16:59 +0000 UTC]

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Ziixx [2016-03-24 08:04:28 +0000 UTC]

Hay Okami, I'm working on a plotline for a manga and I had a few questions to ask you. If you don't mind. 

 

 I have two main characters, an Anti-Hero who simply can't decide if he's the villain or not and a Anti-Villain who does all the right things for all the wrong reasons even though he doesn't realize it. In other words the villains think that their heroes and the heroes think that they are villains.  The moral of the story is that no-one ever wants to believe that they were the ones who were wrong.

 

My problem is that I'm not sure how to progress with the story. The two stay in a constant dance with each other and I can't seem to find some kind of terrible evil plot or inciting moment to get things going since they constantly cancel each other out. (I think my characters hate me.  ) 


I thought that maybe I could force them to work together at some point and make the Anti-villain realize that he's been wrong all along, only that it's already too late. But still I cant find a good reason, motive or villain for it to happen. How do I create a conflict that forces two characters, completely opposite from each other to show their true colours? (I want to keep the audience rooting for both sides until the very end. I also have next to no idea which of the character rolls either of them play...I suck with villains. 

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OokamiKasumi In reply to Ziixx [2016-03-26 14:53:20 +0000 UTC]

My problem is that I'm not sure how to progress with the story. The two stay in a constant dance with each other and I can't seem to find some kind of terrible evil plot or inciting moment to get things going since they constantly cancel each other out.
Add a THIRD Character caught in the middle; someone trying to help them both and being Ignored.
 -- Put that third character in danger and make the other two team up to Rescue them.
 -- Make the situation go catastrophically wrong.
 -- Make it so that the only way the third character will survive is if One and Two work together.

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Ziixx In reply to OokamiKasumi [2016-03-27 14:55:35 +0000 UTC]

WOW! That's great! I didnt think of that! Thank you so much for the advice!    

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OokamiKasumi In reply to Ziixx [2016-03-28 04:01:10 +0000 UTC]

I'm glad I could help!

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LunaMondel [2016-02-27 14:00:29 +0000 UTC]

Really helpful, thank you  

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OokamiKasumi In reply to LunaMondel [2016-02-27 15:00:01 +0000 UTC]

I'm glad you liked it, I hope it proves useful.

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LunaMondel In reply to OokamiKasumi [2016-02-27 17:44:05 +0000 UTC]

It did! I always have a way to weak plot, but with your tips I can change that

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Mifubi [2016-02-26 14:04:02 +0000 UTC]

Great advice, as always.

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OokamiKasumi In reply to Mifubi [2016-02-26 16:25:17 +0000 UTC]

Thank you!

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xeristh [2016-02-26 07:18:00 +0000 UTC]

This is interesting! It is great help! Thx

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OokamiKasumi In reply to xeristh [2016-02-26 12:55:46 +0000 UTC]

My pleasure, I'm glad you like it!

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Jedi-Qui-Gon [2016-02-25 15:24:11 +0000 UTC]

Great advice, adding it to favorites!


Though often I feel I have weak characters but a strong plot. Since I feel the characters are not quite 3-D...


Maybe I should try a multi-chapter story to see how things go. Have done mostly single chapter or two chapter stories. A lot of such chances are in the Naruto universe, chances for multi-chapter stories. For example, Kakashi's mission ten years before Clash of Ninja that involved the Land of Snow. That's a perfect one.


Which of your advice pages would help most with weak characters but strong plot?

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OokamiKasumi In reply to Jedi-Qui-Gon [2016-02-25 15:43:51 +0000 UTC]

Weak characters but strong plot?
 -- Hmm... I don't believe I've covered that. I'll have to think on it because it's not a situation I've dealt with before.

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Jinadia In reply to OokamiKasumi [2016-04-02 07:16:26 +0000 UTC]

Please, please, please do a tutorial on that!! It would be amazing!! All your tutorials are great though, thanks for what you do!

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Jedi-Qui-Gon In reply to OokamiKasumi [2016-02-25 18:21:11 +0000 UTC]

That is understandable. Take your time with it, no need to rush.


I can read the character related advice pages again, refresh on things.


And of course write a story, after outlining it since I wouldn't want to end up stuck .


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Suu999 [2016-02-25 12:31:19 +0000 UTC]

Your example with superheroes having a fishing contest sounds like one of the example stories provided in the Common Core Wonders stories: it was dull, uninteresting, and not even 1 page, but I already wanted to move on.  In fact, weak plots is the reason why none of the Common Core stories that I teach to my ESL students are so boring.  There's no major conflict or villains to boot.  Although the characters learn a moral, by the time you get to that moral, the story is already lost on you.  In addition to characters with phonics names which make them sound like examples from a how-to-write stories book.  You make me wish I was a Creative Writing teacher lol! 

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OokamiKasumi In reply to Suu999 [2016-02-25 16:04:52 +0000 UTC]

I'm afraid I'm not at all familiar with "Common Core." I tend to write my essay, and get my examples, from my own experience.

If you want to teach writing, don't bother with anything labelled "creative."
 -- Creative writing is about expressing yourself with words -- not crafting stories. It's fine for those who don't intend to ever get published, but for those who eventually want their work accepted by a publishing house? Simply reading your favorite genre will teach you far more about world-building, making a working plot, and creating the right characters to make that plot happen.

If you want to teach basic story writing in a way that would be useful toward story-crafting, have the kids pick a favorite Movie then have them outline the major turning points in the story. (Where the characters' decisions turned the course of the story.) After that, have them chart out how the story would have changed if a Different Character (one from a different movie,) had been at those turning points.

For example, let's use the move The Matrix. How would the story have changed if the character 'Neo' had been switched out with the character 'Riddick' from the movie Pitch Black?

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OrangeHatKiid [2016-02-25 06:17:42 +0000 UTC]

Thanks for the help, Im not much of a writer but have always wanted to write my own story(not just draw everything)....Do you have more like this?

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OokamiKasumi In reply to OrangeHatKiid [2016-02-25 10:17:39 +0000 UTC]

I have somewhere around 50 tutorials posted on DA.
ookamikasumi.deviantart.com/ga…

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OrangeHatKiid In reply to OrangeHatKiid [2016-02-25 06:18:40 +0000 UTC]

Nvm I'm just gonna check your gallery lol   

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AmethystMoon420 [2016-02-25 01:41:55 +0000 UTC]

Wow... I was actually thinking about this a while back, but forgot about it. These are good tips! Thank you!

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OokamiKasumi In reply to AmethystMoon420 [2016-02-25 10:18:44 +0000 UTC]

You're welcome!
 -- I'm glad you like my tutorials. I like helping my fellow writers.

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daMeowse [2016-02-24 23:39:23 +0000 UTC]

The first part really helped (Strong characters but a weak plot) but the rest of it.. :/
You focused a lot on how romance stories are created, and while its nice knowing the difference between the three, and i'm sure they'll help quite a few people with fanfiction potentially, but IMO they all look similarly structured. I know you said we didn't have to take advice if it didn't suit us, but I really like how you explain things!

Would love to see a post focusing on how some other types of stories with weak plot points can be fixed,  Fantasy, Adventure, Sci-fi etc? 
~Cheers

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OokamiKasumi In reply to daMeowse [2016-02-25 00:27:07 +0000 UTC]

"Would love to see a post focusing on how some other types of stories with weak plot points can be fixed,  Fantasy, Adventure, Sci-fi etc?"

Well, that's the thing, it works the same way no matter what genre you use, Romance or not. I simply picked the Romance genre as an example because Romance authors are where the bulk of my questions come from.

Reading "The Writer's Journey" by Vogler will give you everything you want to know about writing any type of Adventure from Sci-Fi to Fantasy since all three follow almost the exact same plot pattern. That book goes into serious detail too, far more than any one of my little tutorials.

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Crystaldragons [2016-02-24 23:28:49 +0000 UTC]

thanks for that. helped me a little bit finishing my first story. I already killed off my villain and now I'm focusing on the final few chapters before I do any editing on the other chapters.

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OokamiKasumi In reply to Crystaldragons [2016-02-25 00:21:10 +0000 UTC]

I'm glad I could help, even if it was only a little.

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twilirito94 [2016-02-24 20:40:21 +0000 UTC]

Wow this is really helpful I'm trying to work on a project that I have been planning for two years and anything like this helps a lot for a starter like me.

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OokamiKasumi In reply to twilirito94 [2016-02-24 21:30:04 +0000 UTC]

I'm glad I could provide a bit of insight.
 -- I love being helpful.

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Quibbledink [2016-02-24 18:50:16 +0000 UTC]

Thanks for putting so much work into this. I have the same problem where I don't think the story itself has as much substance as it should, but that's still in development. I like how you wrote out the stages of romance, I thought it was funny because it almost reminded me of the romance I'm working on. Whelp, I need to reconsider myself.

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OokamiKasumi In reply to Quibbledink [2016-02-24 19:31:46 +0000 UTC]

I'm glad you liked my efforts.
 -- A lot of writers start by creating characters first. Because I normally start with a Plot then make the characters to fit, it never actually occurred to me to write up something about this, until recently. So... Tutorial.

The Stages of Romance...
 -- LOL! It's a habit of mine to break down stories into base outlines, especially if the plot is common for a specific Genre. It makes it much easier and quicker to construct a whole story guaranteed to fit that genre. Writing becomes almost Plug & Play.

Just because you followed a common genre outline does NOT make you Wrong!
 -- Look at it this way... The Romance plot-line is used so much because it's Popular with the Readers. Popular meaning: it's what most people Wanted to read. Therefore, casually following it won't hurt your work at all -- especially if you are writing a Romance.

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Quibbledink In reply to OokamiKasumi [2016-02-25 01:32:12 +0000 UTC]

I don't mind that I instinctively write about the lowest, common denominator, that being romance. Hahah, I like having my characters fall in love. What I don't want is for it to look poorly-handled or cliche. I am still working on constructing the story and such.

I've read so many bad stories and what I noticed, they do often put exceptional attention on the Mary Sue character, while the plot itself is just sort of "ehh..." I've read a lot fo stories like that and I cannot begin to tell you what they were about, they were just following around a girl and her issues with some supernatural boyfriend or whatever else. I definitely do not want my work to come out like that.

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OokamiKasumi In reply to Quibbledink [2016-02-25 10:26:59 +0000 UTC]

Well, that's simple enough.
 -- Don't write what you Don't Like and it won't happen. Seriously.

 -- If you think a scene is boring, toss in an attack of some kind to punch it up. (Pun intended.)
 -- If the love scene is getting too mushy, throw in some verbal teasing to make yourself (and your characters) laugh.

In short, if you don't like where a scene is going, shove it elsewhere.

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Quibbledink In reply to OokamiKasumi [2016-02-25 18:58:14 +0000 UTC]

Those are really helpful tips, thanks. I don't feel so worried anymore about the romance, since my characters are not mushy at all. Again, thanks. 

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OokamiKasumi In reply to Quibbledink [2016-02-25 21:57:48 +0000 UTC]

My pleasure.

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