Comments: 37
AndroolG [2016-09-26 18:27:59 +0000 UTC]
I disagree.
I made story without any plot at all or very weak alibi plot in PnP rpg in the past that where amongst the preferred of my players because theirs characters were free to show there true colours not leaded by a story and trying to solve it. Obviously it's harder in a writed text since your character don't have free will and you have to make them do things without a plot that lead them but a slice of life story can have no plot and more style than the best plot stories.
Some very good book are known for their strong plot, other for the very well depicted scenery, other for a very deep character psychology. Most of the best authors in writing history weren't the best at everything and it was ok for them not to be because they had a deeper understanding of other facets of writing.
Not having everything on top is part of an artist style.
I was astonished when I heard a critic say he didn't like props movies when talking of a Tim Burton movie. Of course he was right but for me Tim Burton even if he is better at creating a mood than a story or a plot, he still is a genius. So yes if you are really strong at something, it is ok to be weak somewhere else.
I know of course that what you say in the end is "you have to work your weak points" and you are right of course. But the real answer is yes it can be ok.
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Ziixx [2016-03-24 08:04:28 +0000 UTC]
Hay Okami, I'm working on a plotline for a manga and I had a few questions to ask you. If you don't mind.
I have two main characters, an Anti-Hero who simply can't decide if he's the villain or not and a Anti-Villain who does all the right things for all the wrong reasons even though he doesn't realize it. In other words the villains think that their heroes and the heroes think that they are villains. The moral of the story is that no-one ever wants to believe that they were the ones who were wrong.
My problem is that I'm not sure how to progress with the story. The two stay in a constant dance with each other and I can't seem to find some kind of terrible evil plot or inciting moment to get things going since they constantly cancel each other out. (I think my characters hate me. )
I thought that maybe I could force them to work together at some point and make the Anti-villain realize that he's been wrong all along, only that it's already too late. But still I cant find a good reason, motive or villain for it to happen. How do I create a conflict that forces two characters, completely opposite from each other to show their true colours? (I want to keep the audience rooting for both sides until the very end. I also have next to no idea which of the character rolls either of them play...I suck with villains.
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OokamiKasumi In reply to Ziixx [2016-03-26 14:53:20 +0000 UTC]
My problem is that I'm not sure how to progress with the story. The two stay in a constant dance with each other and I can't seem to find some kind of terrible evil plot or inciting moment to get things going since they constantly cancel each other out.
Add a THIRD Character caught in the middle; someone trying to help them both and being Ignored.
-- Put that third character in danger and make the other two team up to Rescue them.
-- Make the situation go catastrophically wrong.
-- Make it so that the only way the third character will survive is if One and Two work together.
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Ziixx In reply to OokamiKasumi [2016-03-27 14:55:35 +0000 UTC]
WOW! That's great! I didnt think of that! Thank you so much for the advice!
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OokamiKasumi In reply to Ziixx [2016-03-28 04:01:10 +0000 UTC]
I'm glad I could help!
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LunaMondel [2016-02-27 14:00:29 +0000 UTC]
Really helpful, thank you
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OokamiKasumi In reply to LunaMondel [2016-02-27 15:00:01 +0000 UTC]
I'm glad you liked it, I hope it proves useful.
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Mifubi [2016-02-26 14:04:02 +0000 UTC]
Great advice, as always.
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xeristh [2016-02-26 07:18:00 +0000 UTC]
This is interesting! It is great help! Thx
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OokamiKasumi In reply to xeristh [2016-02-26 12:55:46 +0000 UTC]
My pleasure, I'm glad you like it!
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Jedi-Qui-Gon [2016-02-25 15:24:11 +0000 UTC]
Great advice, adding it to favorites!
Though often I feel I have weak characters but a strong plot. Since I feel the characters are not quite 3-D...
Maybe I should try a multi-chapter story to see how things go. Have done mostly single chapter or two chapter stories. A lot of such chances are in the Naruto universe, chances for multi-chapter stories. For example, Kakashi's mission ten years before Clash of Ninja that involved the Land of Snow. That's a perfect one.
Which of your advice pages would help most with weak characters but strong plot?
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OokamiKasumi In reply to Jedi-Qui-Gon [2016-02-25 15:43:51 +0000 UTC]
Weak characters but strong plot?
-- Hmm... I don't believe I've covered that. I'll have to think on it because it's not a situation I've dealt with before.
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Jinadia In reply to OokamiKasumi [2016-04-02 07:16:26 +0000 UTC]
Please, please, please do a tutorial on that!! It would be amazing!! All your tutorials are great though, thanks for what you do!
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Suu999 [2016-02-25 12:31:19 +0000 UTC]
Your example with superheroes having a fishing contest sounds like one of the example stories provided in the Common Core Wonders stories: it was dull, uninteresting, and not even 1 page, but I already wanted to move on. In fact, weak plots is the reason why none of the Common Core stories that I teach to my ESL students are so boring. There's no major conflict or villains to boot. Although the characters learn a moral, by the time you get to that moral, the story is already lost on you. In addition to characters with phonics names which make them sound like examples from a how-to-write stories book. You make me wish I was a Creative Writing teacher lol!
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OokamiKasumi In reply to Suu999 [2016-02-25 16:04:52 +0000 UTC]
I'm afraid I'm not at all familiar with "Common Core." I tend to write my essay, and get my examples, from my own experience.
If you want to teach writing, don't bother with anything labelled "creative."
-- Creative writing is about expressing yourself with words -- not crafting stories. It's fine for those who don't intend to ever get published, but for those who eventually want their work accepted by a publishing house? Simply reading your favorite genre will teach you far more about world-building, making a working plot, and creating the right characters to make that plot happen.
If you want to teach basic story writing in a way that would be useful toward story-crafting, have the kids pick a favorite Movie then have them outline the major turning points in the story. (Where the characters' decisions turned the course of the story.) After that, have them chart out how the story would have changed if a Different Character (one from a different movie,) had been at those turning points.
For example, let's use the move The Matrix. How would the story have changed if the character 'Neo' had been switched out with the character 'Riddick' from the movie Pitch Black?
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OrangeHatKiid [2016-02-25 06:17:42 +0000 UTC]
Thanks for the help, Im not much of a writer but have always wanted to write my own story(not just draw everything)....Do you have more like this?
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OokamiKasumi In reply to AmethystMoon420 [2016-02-25 10:18:44 +0000 UTC]
You're welcome!
-- I'm glad you like my tutorials. I like helping my fellow writers.
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daMeowse [2016-02-24 23:39:23 +0000 UTC]
The first part really helped (Strong characters but a weak plot) but the rest of it.. :/
You focused a lot on how romance stories are created, and while its nice knowing the difference between the three, and i'm sure they'll help quite a few people with fanfiction potentially, but IMO they all look similarly structured. I know you said we didn't have to take advice if it didn't suit us, but I really like how you explain things!
Would love to see a post focusing on how some other types of stories with weak plot points can be fixed, Fantasy, Adventure, Sci-fi etc?
~Cheers
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OokamiKasumi In reply to daMeowse [2016-02-25 00:27:07 +0000 UTC]
"Would love to see a post focusing on how some other types of stories with weak plot points can be fixed, Fantasy, Adventure, Sci-fi etc?"
Well, that's the thing, it works the same way no matter what genre you use, Romance or not. I simply picked the Romance genre as an example because Romance authors are where the bulk of my questions come from.
Reading "The Writer's Journey" by Vogler will give you everything you want to know about writing any type of Adventure from Sci-Fi to Fantasy since all three follow almost the exact same plot pattern. That book goes into serious detail too, far more than any one of my little tutorials.
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Crystaldragons [2016-02-24 23:28:49 +0000 UTC]
thanks for that. helped me a little bit finishing my first story. I already killed off my villain and now I'm focusing on the final few chapters before I do any editing on the other chapters.
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OokamiKasumi In reply to twilirito94 [2016-02-24 21:30:04 +0000 UTC]
I'm glad I could provide a bit of insight.
-- I love being helpful.
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Quibbledink [2016-02-24 18:50:16 +0000 UTC]
Thanks for putting so much work into this. I have the same problem where I don't think the story itself has as much substance as it should, but that's still in development. I like how you wrote out the stages of romance, I thought it was funny because it almost reminded me of the romance I'm working on. Whelp, I need to reconsider myself.
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Quibbledink In reply to OokamiKasumi [2016-02-25 01:32:12 +0000 UTC]
I don't mind that I instinctively write about the lowest, common denominator, that being romance. Hahah, I like having my characters fall in love. What I don't want is for it to look poorly-handled or cliche. I am still working on constructing the story and such.
I've read so many bad stories and what I noticed, they do often put exceptional attention on the Mary Sue character, while the plot itself is just sort of "ehh..." I've read a lot fo stories like that and I cannot begin to tell you what they were about, they were just following around a girl and her issues with some supernatural boyfriend or whatever else. I definitely do not want my work to come out like that.
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OokamiKasumi In reply to Quibbledink [2016-02-25 10:26:59 +0000 UTC]
Well, that's simple enough.
-- Don't write what you Don't Like and it won't happen. Seriously.
-- If you think a scene is boring, toss in an attack of some kind to punch it up. (Pun intended.)
-- If the love scene is getting too mushy, throw in some verbal teasing to make yourself (and your characters) laugh.
In short, if you don't like where a scene is going, shove it elsewhere.
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Quibbledink In reply to OokamiKasumi [2016-02-25 18:58:14 +0000 UTC]
Those are really helpful tips, thanks. I don't feel so worried anymore about the romance, since my characters are not mushy at all. Again, thanks.
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