HOME | DD

Keseko In reply to rababco [2014-11-09 21:11:39 +0000 UTC]

The Ice Queen was in fact inspired by the Snow Queen. Though the Snow Queen did not have any minions (not that she needed any, I doubt anyone could survive the extreme winter cold of Finnmark for long, not to mention the Snow Queen would never spare anyone's life unless she's convinced of their worth. Like she was convinced that Kai could help her lift her curse) but the two queens shared many traits such as their cruelty, merciless nature and cold hearts. Though the Snow Queen never wanted to be evil, she was cursed by Satan and therefore unable to see the good and beautiful things in life. Of course, she was redeemed when her heart thawed because she mourned Kai's seeming death, proving that she cared about him.

👍: 1 ⏩: 1

rababco In reply to Keseko [2014-11-10 05:02:38 +0000 UTC]

The Snow Queen's story sounds really sad. It's a little like Elsa's story in Frozen actually. Though Elsa wasn't cruel and heartless she was very distant and cold, convinced she was incapable of love or being loved and had forgotten how to show kindness. It wasn't until her sister was frozen while sacrificing herself for Elsa that Elsa learned how to love again and was able to save her sister.

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Keseko In reply to rababco [2014-11-11 09:32:09 +0000 UTC]

Actually Frozen is very inaccurate. I don't know why they say it's "based on" The Snow Queen, I would rather say "inspired by" the Snow Queen. Since they didn't even use the same characters.
But yes, Elsa was afraid of everything and too afraid to even face her problems. But she was also pretty selfish since she hid in that ice tower of hers while allowing hundreds of people dying from hypothermia after she cursed her town in a permanent winter. I honestly don't know how Anna's sacrifice made Elsa able to control her powers, but I try not to overthink it too much since it's a children's movie.
But I like the Snow Queen better, unlike Frozen, Snow Queen was a story about friendship and a quest for redemption. It's also sweet that a 10 year old girl travelled miles on foot solely to rescue her friend from the Snow Queen. The Snow Queen may not have been truly evil, but due to her encounter with Satan she was corrupted and unable to see anything good about life. But she kidnapped a boy named Kai to help her lift her curse, as she did not want to have the ice-powers since they were both satanic and destructive. Then again, the Snow Queen was not Human, she was an elemental entity in a Human embodiment.
It was also pretty heartwarming to know that the Snow Queen loved Kai as a mother would love her son (the reason why the Queen was crying when Kai was seemingly dead in the end). And there is no love-ending, Kai and Gerda remain friends only in spite of being a boy and a girl.
I am not very satisfied with Frozen because I know the writers could have done much better, Elsa was very undeveloped, Anna was too similar to her predecessors, Hans was too predictable and full of clichés and uninspiring villain (there wasn't even a villain song), Anna fell in love with Kristoff after knowing him for about two days, Olaf was rather annoying than funny (although I found it funny when he fell apart and his lower body ran away in terror instead of reassembling his body) and the ending is very confusing to me, and they deleted a character (Elsa and Anna's cousin) which would have helped the plot much. I'm not saying the movie was bad, I just think it's overrated. I think Tangled was better.

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Starlioness In reply to Keseko [2014-12-10 00:53:56 +0000 UTC]

well, that's a long reply.. kinda stinks they didn't keep the original names for the kids.. what? Gerda and Kai aren't cool enough for you?.. sheesh..I know some of Andersen's characters like the little mermaid were unnamed in the books.. but the Gerda/kai thing bugs me..

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Keseko In reply to Starlioness [2014-12-10 13:32:53 +0000 UTC]

They probably did that because in the original story there was no falling in love thing which Hollywood always wants. This was such a beautiful story between them even though they only remained friends (kind of makes sense since they were only like 12 years old) in the end. Their story wasn't about true love, only about friendship and that friendship is enough love to be able to risk our lives for our friends. But the fact that they cut that out doesn't just bother me, but also the fact that Elsa (which is inspired by the Snow Queen) was an unrealistic coward afraid of her own shadow. The Snow Queen isn't even supposed to be a Human being. Nor is she supposed to be a sweetheart. I wish they'd stick with having her cold-hearted, cruel and vengeful who would rather rule the kingdom with an iron fist. It would make much more sense, as we all know, repressing your emotions like that for so long will have negative consequences such as dissociative identity disorder, which would mean that Elsa would develop another personality which represents her rage and fear.

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Starlioness In reply to Keseko [2014-12-12 01:06:58 +0000 UTC]

well, I got the book now.. so I'm going to read.. but Disney was going to have to Elsa be the villain .. and Let it Go was supposed to a villain song for Elsa. they thought it was to hard to redeem her at the end.. hence the final version to make her more relatable. *shrugs*.. still mad about the Kai and Gerda thing though..

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Keseko In reply to Starlioness [2014-12-12 01:34:07 +0000 UTC]

Yes. They were too lazy to make a decent villain which could have ended with a redemption story. Wouldn't that be the first Disney movie where the villain doesn't die? That sure would be something new to see. The Let it go song could easily have been a villain song since the lyrics obviously imply Elsa's selfishness."The cold doesn't bother me anyway"...Oh sure, it does not bother HER. But it might bother hundreds of other people who probably died from hypothermia because of Elsa's lack of empathy and cowardly acts. And now millions of 5 and 6-year-old girls idolize that movie which took a giant piss on a beautiful fairy tale about the values of friendship, courage, sacrifice and kindness. When I read the Snow Queen as a child, I even shed few tears because I was so in love with H.C. Andersen's tales. That man was a genius and a good man, even though he strongly admired Napoleon and his conquest of Europe (Andersen was a child during the Napoleonic Wars).

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Starlioness In reply to Keseko [2014-12-13 00:55:50 +0000 UTC]

so what about the little mermaid and other Adapted by Disney written by andersen tales? .. the emperor's new groove is very vaguely inspired by Emperor's new clothes?.. and the little match girl short..( I think you can see it on the 2006 version of the TLMermaid DVD) they actually kept the real ending on the that one.. the steadfast tin soldier is another one that was done for fantasia 2000.. your takes?

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Keseko In reply to Starlioness [2014-12-13 17:13:36 +0000 UTC]

The Little Mermaid? Disney didn't really make that one by themselves. Eisner bought the script from Golden Films studios, Disney only did the animation, casting and the songs and Disneyfied the script a bit. Besides, the movie was very inaccurate. In the fairy tale, the mermaid melted into sea foam in the end and died whereas in the movie she married a Prince only because she found him attractive. In the fairy tale she did not have her voice taken, she agreed to allow a sea witch to take a knife and cut off her tongue and turn it into Human legs. She also did not only want to become Human for a handsome prince, she wanted Humanity because she wanted a soul and live eternally in Heaven when she died. Ursula was not an evil witch in the tale, she was neutral but was pretty disturbing and creepy.
How exactly was the Emperor's new groove inspired by the Emperor's new clothes? There was nothing similar between them (Only the title itself was a reference to the fairy tale). I haven't seen Fantasia 2000 other than that Firebird scene, so I don't have anything to say about that.
But Andersen would probably hate Disney for what they've done to his stories's reputations (if we assume just this once that he'd understand what a motion picture/animation is).

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Starlioness In reply to Keseko [2014-12-23 00:12:03 +0000 UTC]

I still kinda wonder how the movie would've turned out Ariel would've turned into sea foam/ascended in heaven? ( thought there was a version about the heaven one somewhere..  probably too hard to sell to little kids.. nowadays...  don't forget Fox and the hound, Pochahontas (o.k she's a real person born  in 1495 so of course she's dead by now.. but  oh well)  don't have the happiest endings in the Disney format..  Hercules might be this too.. hmm.. now that one was really messed up...  yeesh,,

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Keseko In reply to Starlioness [2014-12-23 14:43:40 +0000 UTC]

Actually, Ariel did not go to heaven. She just ceased to exist because she did not get any soul, she just got legs. Pochahontas in the movie was not very accurate. She never fell in love with John Smith, she fell in love with John Rolfe after being converted to Christianity. In fact, Smith met her for the first time when she was about 10 years old and they never really knew each other other than their names. The Fox and the Hound was inaccurate as well but I thought it was quite heart-warming. They were friends until the end and the fox died naturally from old age over the hound's body.
The only Disney films that were somewhat accurate in their stories were Beauty and the Beast, The Hunchback of Notre Dame (although it was definitely not a children's story since Quasimodo's face description would give kids nightmares, Frollo tried to rape Esmeralda, Clopin was a heartless dick, Phoebus wasn't very charming since the only thing he wanted out of Esmeralda was sexual intercourse and Frollo killed his younger brother) and Mulan. And even though the Lion King was good (since it was somewhat based on Hamlet) I wish the ending would have been different. For example, Simba should have just killed Scar and afterwards he would die from his wounds (since everyone in Hamlet died anyway).

👍: 0 ⏩: 0

Firecat15 In reply to J-Henrique-S [2014-07-03 15:43:56 +0000 UTC]

That's because the Snow Queen isn't even the main antagonist of the original story. She's more like neutral.

👍: 0 ⏩: 2

Keseko In reply to Firecat15 [2014-07-04 01:15:47 +0000 UTC]

She was the antagonist. Remember that she was very cold-hearted. She practically forced Kai to come with her to Finnmark.

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Firecat15 In reply to Keseko [2014-07-04 15:48:24 +0000 UTC]

The Wikipedia page doesn't say so.

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Keseko In reply to Firecat15 [2014-07-04 16:12:14 +0000 UTC]

Do you trust a wikipedia article which anyone can edit any time or the actual story written by the actual author? The Snow Queen was the villain, but she was "unwillingly cruel". If I remember right, the mirror which the devils used shows only the bad sides of even the kindest people. The Snow Queen received a curse which could only be lifted by forming the word "eternity" (or eternal, I'm not sure which. I read the story in my native language) out of ice fragments.

Also, The Snow Queen DID practically force Kai to come with her. She kissed him two times, the kisses froze his heart and made him somewhat cold-hearted (literally too) and enslaved him, making him solve the puzzle to lift the curse.

👍: 0 ⏩: 2

the-shattered-number In reply to Keseko [2014-09-24 22:33:16 +0000 UTC]

The version that I read (which may have been copied wrong but what can you do) said that Kai was offered by the Snow Queen to solve the word-riddle in exchange for the world and two new shoes... Or something very similar to that. When he learned the word he became his own master, and it spelled out "eternity". As far as I remember I don't think that solving the puzzle released the Snow Queen from any curse, but I could be wrong. 

Either way, this piece is lovely and seems to portray this scene perfectly. 

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Keseko In reply to the-shattered-number [2014-09-25 15:49:18 +0000 UTC]

You were right about the "eternity" curse solving thing. But the version I read (which I am sure of that it's the original one), the Snow Queen came to Kai and kissed him twice on his forehead. That which froze his heart and made him a bit cold-hearted and emotionless. But the kiss was also a spell which made Kai want to go with the Snow Queen to her home (but deep inside he didn't really want to and was scared). But it was later revealed that the Snow Queen was quite sympathetic character and the real reason why she wanted him is because she was desperate to feel loved by someone, therefore she also wanted Kai as some sort of adopted son, not just a slave. That is probably why she mourned when Kai's frozen heart was nearly killing him (But since hers and Gerda's tears dropped on his body, and because his soul had not yet left his body, Kai survived).
Then the Snow Queen was redeemed and released of her curse which was cast on by Satan.
But yes, this art is perfect. It shows the Queen's sinister icy appearance and yet also her growing concern about her curse and for Kai.

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

the-shattered-number In reply to Keseko [2014-09-26 00:08:55 +0000 UTC]

Ah, this makes sense. Thank you.

👍: 0 ⏩: 0

Firecat15 In reply to Keseko [2014-07-04 16:13:53 +0000 UTC]

Hmmm, maybe you're right, maybe not. Where else should I look for more information?

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Keseko In reply to Firecat15 [2014-07-04 16:25:42 +0000 UTC]

How about reading the story? The original story is the best information you need. I really recommend it, it's one of H.C. Andersen's best ones

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Firecat15 In reply to Keseko [2014-07-19 15:52:50 +0000 UTC]

I'll see what I can do.

👍: 0 ⏩: 0

J-Henrique-S In reply to Firecat15 [2014-07-03 21:26:55 +0000 UTC]

The Queen is an allegory of the devil. And yes, it is the main antagonist.

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Firecat15 In reply to J-Henrique-S [2014-07-03 21:41:12 +0000 UTC]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Snow…

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

J-Henrique-S In reply to Firecat15 [2014-07-03 22:43:14 +0000 UTC]

Wikipedia is not the best source.

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Firecat15 In reply to J-Henrique-S [2014-07-03 22:48:17 +0000 UTC]

She doesn't sound like the villain in the end.

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

J-Henrique-S In reply to Firecat15 [2014-07-03 23:30:46 +0000 UTC]

Snow Queen is the Enlightenment. Andersen was a Christian. You do not understand the story.

👍: 0 ⏩: 1

Firecat15 In reply to J-Henrique-S [2014-07-04 00:01:11 +0000 UTC]

I could've sworn I read the whole page.

👍: 0 ⏩: 0