Comments: 46
changernightstudio [2018-12-14 02:53:26 +0000 UTC]
there are a few cases were the hero is stronger then the bad guys
in my opinion having overpowered ocs as long as they have weaknesses makes them interesting and catches the readers or the viewers attention as long as its not like "my character is so strong not even god can take her down" but rather like this"my character is pretty strong and has lots of abilities but there not unstoppable despite being so strong if they use there powers too much they may pass out and take longer to recover" but that depends of the creator i have ocs that are a bit op but not immortal or unstoppable and as long as the creator can give a good reason why the oc is so strong i think that will make a great plot
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hulkdaddyg [2018-01-20 19:29:32 +0000 UTC]
Good read! My whole team is O! LOL My comic is gonna suck!
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ADE-doodles [2017-10-31 23:24:35 +0000 UTC]
and just to play on the OPOC pool for a while I did this...
ade-doodles.deviantart.com/gal…
OPOCs can be fun... like super sugary deserts and hot and spicy foods.
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devduck01 [2017-07-23 07:47:29 +0000 UTC]
Wonderful piece, thoughtful and well said
I think you some very good ideas on how over powered characters come into being
As a Tabletop RPG GM for over 26 years, I understand the need for balance when creating a character (that is to say balancing strengths and weaknesses in a comic medium not sets of numbers) and that drama and conflict are essential to drive the wheel of story forward.
If the character can never be defeated, then there is no drama, no uncertainty, suspense or excitement. No matter how cool the art is or how well written the prose, the story is flat and boring.
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NewPlanComics In reply to devduck01 [2017-07-23 15:03:33 +0000 UTC]
Actually this was one of the things I didn't like about D&D 4e. It seemed with the revamp of the classes and races you lost the need for a party dynamic at the higher levels. Relying on friends and allies is part of what makes a good RPG. I'm actually just about to begin an adventure in D&D 5e for the first time here soon. Stand back for the Dwarven Ranger!
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ADE-doodles [2017-06-29 15:36:16 +0000 UTC]
Great Commentary. lots of good points. "the more powerful than God" idea has always bugged me on a lot of levels. But OC creators aren't the 1st to go there. I may be wrong but Alan Moore has a few characters that fit that description i think. But he's got other reasons (issues) for it other than just making the badest dude ever ever
But personally, I remember in high school trying to write for UBER powerful OC characters i created and couldn't THINK of much for them to do. so i set them aside and found it hard for me to even CREATE uber power characters for a long time.
more recently I've found ways to imagine some. Initially, it was a more of a joke and play off of the Marvel DC tropes you mention but the more i played with them the more interesting they became to me.
Just a handful though. most of my imagined characters are Mid-range or lower level in strength, with one or 2 powers.
Characters with fewer and more low-level powers tend to be easier and more interesting to imagine and ID with. one of My fav characters has always been Daredevil.
But the CRAZY powerful characters are IMO like hot and spicy foods or SUPER SWEET deserts. It's not something for Breakfast lunch and dinner 7 days a week but sometimes you want it at --or over-- the edge and there's nothing quite like it when it's right.
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WickedPrince [2017-06-15 06:09:14 +0000 UTC]
I am with you. It's fairly common for a reader to look at the mistakes a story hero makes and think "I wouldn't have done that, so I'll create an idealized version of me that doesn't make those kinds of stupid mistakes." and then ends up with a boring character who is never at risk, never makes mistakes, never wallows in self-pity because he screwed up something he shouldn't have, never does anything the least bit interesting for anybody other than the author. And then they can't understand why nobody else loves their OC as much as they do.
The most interesting characters have Achilles Heels. They have flaws that they never figure out how to overcome. You didn't mention it, but Spider-Man's biggest Achilles Heel is Peter Parker's boss: J. Jonah Jameson. Triple J's determination to prove to the world that Spider-man is the enemy of civilization has seen him spend prodigious funds creating opponents who can theoretically take SM down. Except that every single time they go berserk and cause more trouble than SM ever would. And after SM cleans up Triple-J's mess, Triple-J blames the whole thing on SM again. Triple-J has no super powers, SM can't do anything to him though because it would turn Triple-J into a martyr and prove that Triple-J was right about him all along. And yet Triple-J is actually SMs worst enemy.
There was a Russian movie from a few years back: Black Lightning. Our hero's father leads a reconstruction team that goes through old buildings preparing them for demolition and reconstruction. The crew finds a rather ancient yet pristine auto in the sub-basement at a site and decides to show their respect for their leader by gifting the car to him. He decides to pass it on to his son, who is on his way to college - the first member of the family to EVER pass college entry exams. Our young college hero discovers that the car can FLY. Not just drive REALLY fast, but actually fly. At first he merely takes advantage of this for his various delivery jobs. But then he chooses to ignore an injured man lying in the streets as too much trouble to take on and only later realizes that it was his own father he abandoned to die all alone. It was his own inaction that caused the tragedy. Does this sound very familiar? It should. If it doesn't then read up on how Peter lost his beloved Uncle Ben and the lesson he learned from it. It wasn't plagiarism that brought the writers to use this plot, it was a stroke of genius to use a tried and tested method of teaching our would-be-hero to respect his position as a potential hero. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Li…
Here's a secret. It's not what you borrow from somebody else, it's how you redefine it to make it your own. Every story idea anyone will ever have will be derived from some other story, whether the author knows it or not. It's not whether your story or character or what-ever is derivative or not, that can't be avoided, the big thing is how you add humanity to it all to make it interesting. Part of that adding humanity is in crafting the flaws of your character. AND in how your character perseveres through them.
One of my favorite current characters is a female Tiefling Warlock named Farideh - www.goodreads.com/series/95924… - Tieflings are people who have a solid foundation of demon or devil in their heritage. Farideh has a devil's horns and tail, just like her fraternal twin sister. Thanks to a mess-up of her sister's Farideh ends up making a warlock's pact with an agent of HELL. Warlocks are a sort of arcane magic user who gain powers by making a pact with an other-worldly power - many of them form their pacts with agents of the infernal realms. Ultimately Feridah finds that her powers stem from Asmodeus Crown Prince of Hell. One would think that this would push Farideh into being unremittingly evil. But instead she's determined to use all the powers of hell to do good no matter what the source of her powers may demand. That, pardon the pun, is one HELL of a flaw.
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NewPlanComics In reply to WickedPrince [2017-06-15 13:14:15 +0000 UTC]
There are many different stories in the world and often they use similar ideas; changing specific things to make it more personal to the characters involved. It's often been said that there are actually only seven types of stories all being told in different ways. You want characters that will draw your readers in. Overpowering them I think never makes for a good read.
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WickedPrince In reply to NewPlanComics [2017-06-15 23:16:49 +0000 UTC]
The "seven types of stories" line actually has a dozen or more variants. I couldn't remember what the number was so I tried googling it once and I came up with a small multitude of variations. I wish I could remember what terms I used though. Here's one search example though: try "several types of stories" in google: www.google.com/search?q=severe…
The thing is though that it's basically true. Every story that's ever been told fits within a few basic archetypes. The difference is in the details and how you stack them.
And yes, if your character is stronger than Superman, smarter than Batman, more wily than James Bond, faster than the Flash, is a better at magic than Harry Potter, and generally can beat any hero or villain at their own game, what's the point? Nothing is a challenge. There is no risk of loss. No reason why a reader would give a rats rear end. The most interesting characters aren't the ones who cake-walk through everything, they are the ones who struggle, suffer, and muddle their way through.
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DanielJHowe [2017-06-13 06:05:34 +0000 UTC]
This is really good.
I had this problem with my Oc's where I overpowered them all the way to Superman levels... Big mistake, gradually, my heroes power decreased.
You made a really good point with the three powers thing, originally, Lionman only had Super Strength, Super Speed and a Healing Factor, later on, he gained the ability of Parabolic Hearing and seeing in the electromagnetic spectrum.
I've always tried to make my villains more powerful than my heroes because the point you bring up, characters need struggles, even though a portion of the population on my Earth is superhuman.
The thing is, you can't start out with a character of Godly power, if you want to do that, you have to work the character up to date, and even then, it's not a great idea.
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almeidap [2017-06-02 18:30:23 +0000 UTC]
deep read, but so spot on!!! I tend to make OCs that are destined to lose, so I keep power levels low and make the villains more powerful "power corrupts" and all that jazz.
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ZionArchangel [2017-05-30 23:37:12 +0000 UTC]
This is one of my personal pet peeves actually. Wonderful job laying out the fundamentals of it all. I hated mary-sues before I even knew what that term was, It's fundamentally why I can no longer stand free form RPing anymore even though it is one of my favorite things to do. Someone always wants to cram an galactic power level character in a mid-to lower level rp and take over. I personally blame anime to an extent, as I see similarities all over that genre.
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NewPlanComics In reply to ZionArchangel [2017-05-30 23:41:22 +0000 UTC]
I don't blame anime, it honestly happens in every genre. That's not to say it doesn't happen in Anime however. I think Dragonball Z is rife with it. The continuous pattern of evolution is really over the top.
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ZionArchangel In reply to NewPlanComics [2017-05-31 01:10:56 +0000 UTC]
when looking at the source material, and then the fans of it, I find that comics (for the most part) have a great balance of flaws and deep character development. Most movies and sci-fi in the main stream you find great depth and character development through odds and flaws. It tends to be the fans and the OC'ers that take it upon themselves to insert their own characters and storylines into that of the main protagonists instead of trying to involve them into their own storylines and problems. But in anime I find that mary-sue types are all over the source material... so how can you not have fans and OC's that follow the pattern themselves?
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TheOrderForever1 [2017-05-30 20:06:07 +0000 UTC]
lol depends on the creator and they want in their universe. We have preferences and our reason to even create. But a good story will always help.
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NewPlanComics In reply to TheOrderForever1 [2017-05-30 20:43:01 +0000 UTC]
Help? Story is incredibly important. The story sets up character, perspective, and even the world in which the hero exists in. All these things are as defining to a hero as a stat sheet. Without the story you don't have any intention of a character, just abilities. And when all you see is a character sheet of an Omega Level Character it is very easy to get jaded on what could be interpreted as a Mary Sue type that has to be better than all the rest.
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Asssassin000 [2017-05-30 14:57:16 +0000 UTC]
So since I'm new I don't think I can say too much but I do agree with the article but at the same time it comes down to preference and what kind of universe the creator has in mind for his character. If the creator has a street level OC and wants to build his universe around that then I see reason to have a powerful character but if the creator has a major villain that's like waaaaay op then I see why he or she would have a hero that's powerful as well or several powerful characters just to take down one major villain. Like my OC Assassin 0 I do feel I can limit his abilities from the feedback I'm getting but I don't think he's nearly as powerful as some other OC's I've seen like Gilead, I-Force, Batking or Vector. Those guys even with Assassin 0 weaknesses adaptation power would stand a chance with those guys but that's ok and I'm fine with that. I can see that those guys are powerful because of the villains they may face. As much as I like Batman, he's no match physically with let's say a Thanos or Darksied. Granted his intelligence will keep him in the fight but that won't last long and he always has a heavy hitter backing him up because he always has a back up plan. So once again I think it's all on the creators preference. ( sorry if I didn't tag the creators to the OC's I mentioned. I don't know how to fa that yet HAHA)
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NewPlanComics In reply to gwdill [2017-05-30 14:54:44 +0000 UTC]
It certainly can be. I'm not saying there isn't a place for the extremely powerful characters, but it has to be done carefully. Hyperion, would be a good example.
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MidnightOwl07 In reply to NewPlanComics [2017-05-30 19:00:34 +0000 UTC]
Yeah, Hyperion is my favorite "Superman" type hero in the mainstream comic. I even prefer the guy more than the perfect Clark.
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NewPlanComics In reply to MidnightOwl07 [2017-05-30 20:46:36 +0000 UTC]
Hyperion is probably one of the best examples of this as well. Not only is he Marvel's answer to Superman, and incredibly powerful alien, his weakness makes him one of the most dangerous people in Marvel to be around.
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GuyGenesis [2017-05-30 12:29:08 +0000 UTC]
Nice article. To each their own, but I agree. Though I feel the blame for this goes back onto the mainstream authors, always cranking up their character's powers in-order to overcome the bad guy. Then a more powerful bad guy appears, and the cycle repeats.
---
Examples
Who's faster, Flash or Superman?
Who's stronger, Hulk or Superman?
Who would win in a fight, Batman or Superman? (admittedly kryptonite)
but these should not even be questions -- Since superman is a jack of trades, his power levels for each should suffer in comparison to someone whose sole focus is a single power, Flash faster, Hulk stronger and a Batman should never be able to stand toe-to-toe with a Superman. That's why you have team-ups to overcome the ultimate threat you just can't handle on your own.
---
I too have been guilty of this, but have come to realize that my characters doesn't need to be the most powerful, nor do I want them to be. You lose a whole range of stories by overpowering. A good old fashioned car chase and the Flash -- He literally and effortlessly takes them out of the car, boom done vs Spiderman, he has to figure out where they're going, how to beat them there, and have time to spin a web. The later scenario in my opinion is much more exciting.
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NewPlanComics In reply to GuyGenesis [2017-05-30 13:00:25 +0000 UTC]
Every creator ever has been guilty of this at one point. It's a rather beginner mistake. Even my own OC, Turbulence, had a much more grandiose beginning and power set. It was only through actual writing did I realize he was to much and begin to taper him down into his current form. But as you said if there is no effort, no obstacle to overcome, the story doesn't hold water.
It's not about who's hero is the best, it's supposed to be about what the hero had to overcome to defeat his adversary. And since heroes generally work on the same side it isn't about heroes combating each other.
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GuyGenesis In reply to NewPlanComics [2017-05-30 14:07:49 +0000 UTC]
agreed, although I also like the aspect of a grey character or the anti-hero finding himself at odds with the hero due to the means by which they both achieve the same goal.
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NewPlanComics In reply to GuyGenesis [2017-05-30 14:32:15 +0000 UTC]
The anti-hero is a whole other ball of wax my friend.
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NewPlanComics In reply to Jonathan-Bluestone [2017-05-30 12:17:00 +0000 UTC]
What? Like overpowering characters never happens in science fiction. I'm looking at you Q and your little friends the Borg as well.
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NewPlanComics In reply to Jonathan-Bluestone [2017-05-30 14:30:28 +0000 UTC]
When I mentioned Q and the Borg I was making a general Syfy reference, as Star Trek is very well known in the science fiction genre.
You've done absolutely nothing to upset me, and I apologize if I've come off that way. I love Judge Dredd he is a very human take on a character in extreme situation. But like all writing it has its own level of pseudoscience that goes with it whether we're talking about comic book characters, Star Trek, Judge Dredd, or any science fiction or fantasy writing.
Such as why does Superman fly? Helium. Kryptonians fart helium. Or at least I'm pretty sure that's how it goes.
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RODCOM1000 [2017-05-30 06:05:29 +0000 UTC]
This is a great article! We all have our reasons for creating our OC's with the power levels or power sets that we do,
but lots of people paint themselves into a corner by creating an unbeatable character with nowhere to go.
IMHO heroism is born of sacrifice and if your character cant be beat or hurt where's the sacrifice? Hence, where's heroism?
My OC has a pretty high power set, but I also built in weaknesses that are exploitable so that the heroic story can be found in his struggle to overcome them.
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NewPlanComics In reply to RODCOM1000 [2017-05-30 13:38:09 +0000 UTC]
And weaknesses can be what truly makes a hero great. Without incorporating that in to there heroes I think many creators do a disservice to the characters.
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Kaemgen [2017-05-30 04:38:38 +0000 UTC]
I agree... but...
It really all depends on the purpose of the character and the audience it is intended for, if any.
If the sole purpose of the OC is wish fulfillment and the audience sought is only the creator, then *shrug* If that is what they find entertaining, more power to them. The problem of overpowering only becomes a problem when one wants to interact with other people's OCs or to gain an audience. Though it is definitely a problem then...
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NewPlanComics In reply to Kaemgen [2017-05-30 12:20:21 +0000 UTC]
I can agree if the character is only for the creator than it's all good. For Me, By Me. It's at the point where the creators reach out. Defining the intended audience can be very important.
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Kaemgen In reply to NewPlanComics [2017-05-30 16:59:19 +0000 UTC]
Yes, once you desire an audience you need to tailor to their wants and, more importantly, needs.
Personally I'd rather have an underpowered character who finds a way to win despite their limits and tend to find that kind of story far more interesting... But some people just need to be the best no matter what.
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AlastorZingari [2017-05-30 04:34:38 +0000 UTC]
I never really got the grasp of making overpowered characters, at least once I grew past the point in highschool where it's all I did. Creating powerful characters is fun, and ok, but creating a character that is capable of overcoming all the obstacles and all the odds, just creates a boring narrative. If nothing can stand in front of the character you're writing, neither can a good story.
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NewPlanComics In reply to AlastorZingari [2017-05-30 12:16:07 +0000 UTC]
And that to me is extremely important. The Narrative of a story is extremely important. I think many new creators forget that comics are in fact a story telling device using both visual and written mediums. Failing to take that into account gets these creators into the predicament I'm talking about above.
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cptmeatman [2017-05-30 02:58:46 +0000 UTC]
Well written. I fully admit that I started out doing this year and years ago and I'm sure most of us did. It's always essential to consider the "hero's journey" in creating characters, at least protagonists, but I find that it can be applied to just about any character.
Always start out a character with a "state of rest," what their normal life was like before the events of their story, and an "inciting incident," the major turning point that sets them on their path to becoming a hero.
"Star Wars IV: A New Hope" is an example of the hero's journey to a T. Luke Skywalker, the powerful Jedi Master who, nearly single handed, took down the Galactic Empire, started out as a whiny farm kid (state of rest) until he encounters R2-D2 and his message from Leia. (Inciting Incident)
While I stick more to fantasy and scifi rather than super heroes, the idea is the same. Spiderman was a wimpy nerd until the bite from the spider and the death of uncle Ben. Captain America was a wimpy kid until he met Dr. Erskine and was turned into a super soldier.
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NewPlanComics In reply to cptmeatman [2017-05-30 12:13:47 +0000 UTC]
I think Luke Skywalker and Spider-man are wonderful examples of character progression in a case like this. The 'state of rest' as you put it is important. knowing who the character was before they were incredible allows for some very interesting perspective.
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